*** Science Or God? ***

[koolbluez]

Re: ***science Or God?***

As some other jokes go on...
When a guy speaks about... I believe only what I see... there is no God... his friend slaps him... The 1st guy cries back... it's paining. The friend asks - Where's the pain? Show me.

As we all "educated people" know... there r some things that cant b seen but felt. God is the name we give to everything abstract... which we don't believe or anything which can't b explained by science. The conscience.. for eg... is ur God. When u do a mistake, u feel that u r doin one.. a regret lingers in ur mind... that conscience... is an unexplained science. That is one of the "gods".
Until & unless all phenomena can b perfectly explained, God'll exist.

U can't mix God & science.. like say... water & oil

Atheistism & theistism r two different schools of thought. And bringing them together will only cause clashes.

 

[caleb]

Re: ***science Or God?***

If after so many years of education, u believe in God, it wud be something like an artist falling in love with one of his own creations.

What "wisdom"!... tumhe toh nobel prize milna chahiye yaar...anyway we give you the benifit of the doubt, by assuming that you are a very intelligent person...so who is the atrist? and who is the creation? and how does your comparison make sense? explain oh, wise one to all the mere mortals here!

 

[koolbluez]

Re: ***science Or God?***

^^^ *img116.exs.cx/img116/1231/z7shysterical.gif Well said...

 

[gurujee]

Re: ***science Or God?***

 

[Pathik]

Re: ***science Or God?***

well there is another term for people like me... AGNOSTICS...
we dont know whether god exists or no and we couldnt care less....

 

[s_aerin]

Re: ***science Or God?***

What "wisdom"!... tumhe toh nobel prize milna chahiye yaar...anyway we give you the benifit of the doubt, by assuming that you are a very intelligent person...so who is the atrist? and who is the creation? and how does your comparison make sense? explain oh, wise one to all the mere mortals here!

seems i hv hurt some ppl's feelings.
anyways, what i meant was, believing in god is like believing a story u yourself created.all social sciences have in one way or the other given us a basic idea as to how religion(superstition) evolved.refer to any text book of any school.
and like the fellow above me,
we dont know whether god exists or no and we couldnt care less..

 

[amitava82]

Re: ***science Or God?***

by d way, according to www.urbandictionary.com:

theist:

1.Someone who has been brainwashed
2.someone who desperatly hangs on to to an old fairytale-like thoery that has been disproven by science and that never reeeally had any proof in the first place

 

[Yamaraj]

Re: ***science Or God?***

Proofs and theories are for the people of Middle-Earth. As you progress to the higher sciences, it comes to you that nothing is absolute. There are no hard facts that you can prove - not in cosmology and not in Quantum physics.

Perhaps someday in distant future, we'll have a faint understading of the Universe, of the matter and life. Until then, any hard statement in favor or against of anything is nothing more than a personal opinion and matter of preference. And as we all know, opinions are like arseholes; everyone's got one.

 

[caje143]

Re: ***science Or God?***

God Is Great....
Science Is Straight....
So Lets Just Wait....

I Go For God......

 

[Pathik]

Re: ***science Or God?***

:d O-> !! Science Science Science !! <-o :d

 

[caleb]

Re: ***science Or God?***

seems i hv hurt some ppl's feelings.
all social sciences have in one way or the other given us a basic idea as to how religion(superstition) evolved.

No hurt feelings mate...it is fight club...basically we are just wasting bandwidth...so coll...no hard feeling and also it is not personal.

Anyway getting back to the "fight"...kidding...we are talking about the existence of God not "how religion (superstition) evolved".

 

[Aberforth]

Re: ***science Or God?***

As some other jokes go on...
When a guy speaks about... I believe only what I see... there is no God... his friend slaps him... The 1st guy cries back... it's paining. The friend asks - Where's the pain? Show me.

Thats a bad example. If I slap you and your body's hormone profile is done at the same time, the cortisol level rises which means you did feel a difference to your body. Pain is because there is a drastic change in the body state which the neurons act as reflex action (pain) to avoid. Furthermore pain can be clearly felt, you don't need a very hard imagination or to teach a child as he grows up, "When I slap you, you feel pain, understand? Pain exists". A child feels pain even if you slap it at infacy but isn't likely to be a theist if grown without theism.

Proofs and theories are for the people of Middle-Earth. As you progress to the higher sciences, it comes to you that nothing is absolute. There are no hard facts that you can prove - not in cosmology and not in Quantum physics.

Well that wouldn't be a reason to believe in something that doesn't exist or has even been proven to exist. 'Absolute' you talk about refers to relativity, and relativity doesn't endorse God either, God is still an imaginative concept and unless its existence is proven by people and we can verify it, we can't assume it exists just like we assume boogeyman and tooth fairy don't exist.

 

[Yamaraj]

Re: ***science Or God?***

Well that wouldn't be a reason to believe in something that doesn't exist or has even been proven to exist. 'Absolute' you talk about refers to relativity, and relativity doesn't endorse God either, God is still an imaginative concept and unless its existence is proven by people and we can verify it, we can't assume it exists just like we assume boogeyman and tooth fairy don't exist.

How many of us believe that Black Holes exist? And how many that don't? The fact is, except for a few mathematical equations, there is no concrete way to prove that black holes do exist. And every once in a while some scientist comes up with data that indicates otherwise. Still, people contiune to believe that they exist, among other things, only because they've read so in text books. At quantum level, a particle can both exist and not exist at the same point of time. And it may exist at two or multiple different places at once.

I'm definitely not playing apologist for the religious. Far from it! But science is only a way of understanding things around us. It doesn't and probably cannot explore the dimensions of What and Why of the largest and smallest. I believe it's too early to conclude if there's a supreme being or not, for we know little about the things we're starting to see.

I'm against all organized religions, their propaganda, self-declared gods and rituals. But the philosophy therein isn't to be ignored. I'm of the opinion that if spirituality and philosophy are sensual, then science is pornography. It provides all the details you long for, but it's as coarse as it can get.

 

[koolbluez]

Re: ***science Or God?***

Skeptics... I stay aloof from them. They don't know whom to believe or what to believe. I doubt if they believe in themselves too... mayb a "hormone profile" might verify it

I'm not a religious devout. But I do believe that there is something governing everything. Something more unimaginable (@ our present scientific stature) that actually runs the show. And.. all yea "scientists/developed guyz/educated guyz"... we all know that most things r not perfect. Everywhere there is an assumption. Even our physics equations have more assumptions than solutions. Well... for ur belief.. God is also an assumption. But still.. as every regular student uses in his equations, we too use God in our lives equation. Like it or not.

Believe it or leave it. U life's ur hell. Enjoy it C ya...

 

[Ganeshkumar]

Re: ***science Or God?***

I dont beleive in God...
But anyway...
We can believe on those who say THERE IS NO GOD, But Dont beleive on those who say I AM GOD OR I AM GODS CONVEYOR...

 

[cooldip10]

Re: ***science Or God?***

- So many bleieve in God
me too , but the only difference is that ..
I completely don't believe in anything that Science has not proven..

 

[Aberforth]

Re: ***science Or God?***

I'm of the opinion that if spirituality and philosophy are sensual, then science is pornography. It provides all the details you long for, but it's as coarse as it can get.

Science and pornography do not really mix when the context is brought. It would be closer to sexuality and sensuality. However considering your analogy, what today may seem coarse might be a driving force to what could be achieved tomorrow. In your analogy, it is like porn industry helping in the adoption and popularisation of new technologies.

Still, people contiune to believe that they exist, among other things, only because they've read so in text books.

That is a very generalized assumption. That might apply to theists, who have been counciously fed the idea of God since childhood that the idea lodges to the subconscious memory.

Science is not about 'beliefs' and 'faith' on books or ideas; both of which are imaginary but about 'knowledge' and these 'knowledge' requires thinking, reasoning, hypothesis and deduction. It must also be reproducible in laboratory conditions or observed with the right tools and skills by a lot of people. Philosophically speaking, to a scientist the universe is an adventure and has uncountable mysteries to be explored, the more he uncovers the more satisfying it is.

People without this open mind and mental prowess would never understand the stimulation so would prefer to loosen their minds in spirituality, leave all to imaginary catharsis and pillar called God and sit back.

 

[crs_cwiz]

Re: ***science Or God?***

Hey, I'm quite late into the debate, but this is something i've thought over for years now, so here are "my" opinions:

Both the sides should stop trying to prove that they are ultimately correct and the other is wrong. All the Big-Bang theories aren't there just because they are impressive, sound good or give a fantastic theatre to the beginning of the universe. They have some real simple logic and reason behind it, not to mention some common sense (read A Brief History Of Time By Stephen Hawking for more info) People would ask that if the bigbang did occur, then where did all that energy come from in the first place? the answer is that there is no energy - the total energy in the entire universe, when totaled up, comes out to be zero (planets are positive energy converted to mass and gravity is the negative energy. Experiments have been performed to prove this fact.) But then again, things become murky as I myself cannot explain why the fundamental charge is so finely tuned to be 1.6*10^(-19) C (had it been slightly different, stars would not have existed) But if the believers-of-God are starting to rejoice, let me tell them that many things HAVE been proved which seriously restrict God to the point where he can only turn on the universe if he wants, 'cause after that he would not have any choice. If you want proof again, I'm not gonna waste my time typing, read the above mentioned book, and also "the Universe in a Nutshell" by the same author.

So my conclusion - we simply aren't smart enough yet to decide whether God exists or not, whether you take the scientific view ( that a few more million years are required to evolve more) or the religious (God didnt want us to be so smart that we can question our own creator)

So then, on whose side am I? I'm an atheist, even though many things haven't been proved. That's because if you were to see both sides, you would realise that science explains almost everything except the biggest questions of the universe, whereas religion (Im not talking about God, I'm talking about religion) attempts to answer these big questions, while failing to answer even the smaller ones. And, also because my religion (or I should say former religion; I was very religious until I became atheist when I was 10 due to a set of circumstances, and even after 7 years now, I have not found a single reason to regret my decision, except I save more time not having to regularly pray or going to temples) does not allow rational thinking. If something bad happens, it's my fate. Or if something good happens, it's because of God's will. Why God's will, why not my hard work? I study day and night out burning my ass to get a top rank in an IIT coaching institue and it because of "God's will"?????

 

[zyberboy]

Re: ***science Or God?***

Well I don't have to believe in something that doesn't exist and there have been no proofs of existence..

If you can prove the existance of god, ill believe you. Why should i believe in something that cant be seen or felt.

As already said u need proof of existence

Seriously, I would ask anyone who believes in God or ghosts to provide sufficient evidence

believe in science and realise many things than believing in something which doesnt not exist...
proof of nonexistence of god is its nonexistence itself!!!!!

hhmmm....so many post asking for proof for the existence of god.
Then here is the proof , The proof i am presenting here are respected even in scientific community.And i also admit that last yr this time i was atheist but today i am not.
Not only becoz of this proof but also some events in my life.

Some of u may have heard this but in order to understand this fully u must really dig deep,think about it atleast for one day.
dont read dis with defensive mind

First cause(Etiological ) proof can be stated as follows:

1. Everything that exists or begins to exist has a cause.

> yes even for small events has a cause,for example a falling leaf has a cause behind it may be a wind or something else,power cut u know something is causing it,like this every small, even a motion of electron has a cause behind it.


2. The universe exists and began to exist.
> everyone knows it exist ,there must be a cause which has no cause behind it , something familiar isn't?

3. The universe must have a cause.
>come up with a event that has no cause behind it, u can't

4. The cause of the universe is God.

>why not ,universe need a first cause,and universe still exist, for universe to exist there must be a cause...it must be eternal....all things start from this first cause....sound's familiar...yes for long time now holly books like Geetha,bible r saying in a simple way that people could understand.

Still doesn't get the grip rewind every event in ur life(has a cause) very fast and to the doom's day(before big bang).Even Big bang need a cause behind it,And u know it has to start from some where isn't?

THERE MUST BE ATLEAST A SUPERPOWER ABOVE ALL

 

[Yamaraj]

Re: ***science Or God?***

That is a very generalized assumption. That might apply to theists, who have been counciously fed the idea of God since childhood that the idea lodges to the subconscious memory.

Science is not about 'beliefs' and 'faith' on books or ideas; both of which are imaginary but about 'knowledge' and these 'knowledge' requires thinking, reasoning, hypothesis and deduction. It must also be reproducible in laboratory conditions or observed with the right tools and skills by a lot of people. Philosophically speaking, to a scientist the universe is an adventure and has uncountable mysteries to be explored, the more he uncovers the more satisfying it is.

People without this open mind and mental prowess would never understand the stimulation so would prefer to loosen their minds in spirituality, leave all to imaginary catharsis and pillar called God and sit back.

Science never gets in the way of spirituality. It's only a different way of exploring the nature and appreciating it. But science is not without its limitations either. All the theories and equations have only helped unleash what's already there. Gravity existed long before there was any Newton, and so did relativity. Scientists are not inventing or discovering things, they're only opening our minds to things we never thought of.

Spirituality, philosophy and religion, to some extent, deal with entirely different issues. In ancient times, when people were not so "intelligent" and blessed with scientific methods, this World came up on them as a great creation. Creation, because nothing can exist in void. And for a creation to exist, there must be a creator. Or so the stupid "theists" thought!

Don't fall for the trap Atheists have been planning all along. Science cannot and will never be able to explain all things that already exist. We humans, will all our technology, have looked deep into the space. And we found billions and billions of galaxies, with billions upon billions of stars in each of them. And we haven't seen it all yet. I'm not religious, but I fully understand the limitations of science. There have been times in scientific coomunity when they stumbled upon the idea of a "creator", or a supreme being. But the inherent politics and Anti-Christian-God agenda that lies therein, forced a few to choose different path.

Forget the rituals and stupid elements of religions, gods and demons, mantras and sermons. Forget the priests and pundits and all their propaganda, and then you'll have the core of religions. Is it mere coincidence that Hindu mythology comes pretty close to modern calculations of the age of the Universe? And how do you explain the "oscillatory Universe" in Hindu mythology that is driving the cosmologists wild? According to some recent development, oscillatory Universe theory is probably the best one of all.

Technically, I'm an agnostic. I think it cannot be known if there's a supreme being or not. I think we humans are too full of ourselves to be rational. If you look closely, you are only a high-level abstraction of life. You are made of millions of different alive organisms working on their own, yet you have self-conciousness. And all alive beings are merely composed of the same elements that other objects are made of. The only difference is the order of arrangement.

The common man is always very quick in drawing conclusions. Blame it on the information available, or lack thereof. Ask any good physicist or cosmologist worth his salt and you'll know what science is about, and what it's not. And by the way, you're wrong about exploring the Universe and getting satisfaction from it. From what I know about cosmology, the more we know about the Universe, the less satisfying it is. And more confusing, of course!