Reasons for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

[mediator]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

It's the only non-system software that requires a restart.

Its system software. Right??

 

[mail2and]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

Its system software. Right??

Oops, that was a typo. Thanks for pointing out.

 

[aryayush]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

Why does it need a restart like Windows after an update? No restart in Linux after an update !!

Mac OS X requires a restart oly after a major operating system update or a firmaware update. No more and no less. And as tech_your_future confirmed, even Linux requires that.

And 1.5 months is less I guess. Many linux PC's have an uptime of more than 3 months ! Forget about servers. And the performance doesn't degrades !!!!

He expressly stated that he had to shut the machine down due to a power cut. For all we know, it may have run for another year!

Not always! Not with the new distros today! The case is same even with windows that incompatabilites arises when hardware is latest. But resolved only after some updates!! Does Mac support different hardwares??

Yeah, I do agree that hardware support in the various Linux distros is not a problem anymore. They support almost any sort of hardware you connect to them nowadays. Ubuntu even recognised the 'Eject' button on my MacBook Pro keyboard.
But Mac OS X isn't lagging in the department either; it supports virtually any piece of hardware out there. As yet, I have only connect four external devices to it but all four have worked flawlessly without requiring any manual installation of drivers. I have connected my Sony Ericsson W550i, LaCie 250GB external hard drive, Transcend 256MB USB drive and a Sony digital camera. On connecting the camera, iPhoto popped up in a flash and offered to import the photos for me. Ingenious!

and one's gotta learn some command line stuff

Not anymore!!

Oh c'mon! Don't kid yourself. Linux distros are practically unusable if you want to do something even remotely advanced and don't want to be friendly with the Terminal. Just run a search for 'Linux tips' on Google; eight out of ten tricks require you to fire up the terminal. Browse through digit's occasional tips on Linux and you can find terminal commands everywhere. Basically, getting Linux to do anything that it doesn't do by default requires that you copy-paste code from the internet. And what happens when you make some severe mistake (and it is very likely for a newbie to make one) - the whole operating system comes crashing down without so much as a warning sign. I have a brother who has been trying to learn Linux and therefore, uses it on a regular basis. He manages to crash his OS every fortnight or so. When I asked him about it, he told me that it was due to his escapades with the Terminal. I told him to avoid using it and it was he who told me that it's impossible to avoid the Terminal on Linux. And here I am. I have been using the Mac for three months and I have never seen Terminal and I have done such hacks as changing my fans' speed to six times faster (6000 RPM) and install another windows manager (kind of like installing XGL/Compiz on Ubuntu - only much more easy and user-friendly).

Neways commandline is a priviledge bro! It makes task much easier in some cases! Why do people always relate it do geek stuff?

That, my dear friend, is a poor excuse to defend one of Linux's glaring shortcomings and you are aware of that. If the command line interface had been a privilege, open source coders wouldn't have been working their a**es off trying to improve the GUI and make it more user-freindly to try and avoid situations where a simple home user has to resort to the Terminal way of doing things. And the word 'command' and 'easy' simply don't belong in the same sentence!

 

[mediator]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

@aryayush : Hey calm down man! Atleast don't forget the etiquettes to debate here now! I hope u know how I can debate then! There r somethings I'm learning about MAC here n somethings I'm telling u from mah personal experiences on Linux. In between I'm not lying newhere n not "kidding" newhere!! I hope u understand such simple things! Don't u??

I guess ur ignorant about Linux usage to some extent n have low experience on it! Have u checked out new Ubuntu?? Everything can be installed with "Synaptic Package Installer"! Try it n then tell, n then to ur brother too!

There r different Linux distros suited to different people! There r extremely geeky people who like to use Gentoo and then newbies like ur brother who have Ubuntu as their friend! Recommend him Ubuntu. @Jguru says Mandriva2007 is even easier than Ubuntu!! So no commandlines! And I'm certainly not "kidding"!

And what happens when you make some severe mistake (and it is very likely for a newbie to make one) - the whole operating system comes crashing down without so much as a warning sign

Pure Carelessness! Tell him that there exist something called "sudo" n use that instead the "su"! Carelessness using root can destroy any OS! And in Linux u don't need the root to do normal kinds of activities and even to install softwares! U can live by the "make" thing! "Make Install" is to bring it in commandline.The code compiled on ur machine is best for it. I hope u'll agree. Does MAc allows to compile the code on ur machine? Giving u best performance?? Now I know u'll argue that it is part of commandline. So for the GUI thing u have Rpm's and deb files. Just click em and install it like windows setup files!

That, my dear friend, is a poor excuse to defend one of Linux's glaring shortcomings and you are aware of that. If the command line interface had been a privilege, open source coders wouldn't have been working their a**es off trying to improve the GUI and make it more user-freindly to try and avoid situations where a simple home user has to resort to the Terminal way of doing things. And the word 'command' and 'easy' simply don't belong in the same sentence!

Its not a poor excuse mah friend. Its a fact. Most of the things today u can do from commandline to make ur living/working n this free OS, u can do that via GUI too! But there are some concepts like pipelining etc (I hope u know what they r) that can be done only from commandline and I hope MAC supports that from commandline!
Pipelining is a simple concept and a very helpful concept in doing things as quickly as u want like 1. copying the output of a command to a file, 2. searching for specific strings in one go etc! I hope u understand what I'm saying! These things can be done from GUI too, but then for like 2. u open the word editor, open the file and then search the string in it! So lengthy task isn't it?? Try it n u'll know what i mean!!

Similarly for downloading stuff I find commandline much better than all the windows and Linux download accelerators (GUI stuff). Just press "ctrl+shift+n", name the command n put address to it, n then bingo, better speeds n less system resources consumed. Better speeds becoz thats what I ave noticed both in Fedora n Ubuntu! Now for Gui, u go to menu bar, click on icon the app takes some 5 seconds to load (My pc is old) and then type the address in it and then download. It will hog system resources too!
Now u may argue that y u have to type coz u want to show MAC is better in ur new found excitement. Then to tell u, u can copy n paste too! Ofcors u can.

So u see, in todays Linuxes u can live without commandline. Its a priviledge to use it though! Most people use it because it can make ur task done in a very short time! If u don't understand the advantages of commandline in some cases like pipelining that can make ur computing much efficient than ofcors no one can help u to see things correctly! Try pipelining in MAC if it is there n then tell, if u like it or dislike it!

I'm not a geek and dont install linuxes every 6 months to see the beauties in next updgraded distro. But I want easyness and convenience. I know how to compute and I know which is the best way to do it! The concept of commandline is similar to using "Ctrl c", "ctrl V" instead of right clicking the mouse and selecting copy, paste from it! I hope ur clear by now!


So doood, I'm not "kidding"! I'm not debating here on something on which I'm ignorant and u shudn't do that either coz then u'll leave no difference between u n gx! U shudn't debate when u have low experience on any OS. I guess u have negligible on Linux OS. I can understand ur excitement for MAC n can clearly see from ur attitudes n nature here, the reason for which u opened this thread! But don't let that excitement make u a fanboy n prevent u to see the fact! I cud have mocked u badly for ur ignorant views about commandline. But since I'm learning about Mac here as an observer, then may be u shud learn about Linux too in OPen source!

I'm trying to debate here as humbly as I can . So don't put words in mah mouth by talking absurd n ignorant n behaving like gx!! And I'm certainly not "kidding"!!

In here I have talked about free distros, n I hope u know about propreitary ones!

 

[mehulved]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

Well whether CLI is good or bad is just a perception of different people. To each his own.

 

[aryayush]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

@aryayush : Hey calm down man! Atleast don't forget the etiquettes to debate here now! I hope u know how I can debate then!

Hey, I never get riled up on online forums and never lose my cool. And why would I do so here? You are posting your opinions and I am posting mine - each in a friendly manner.
I always try to use friendly emoticons to denote that I am replying cheerfully but I don't know why some people unnecessarily get all worked up (and I am not pointing towards anyone in particular).

 

[mediator]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

^^ I hope u be friendly!

Oh c'mon! Don't kid yourself.

You are posting your opinions and I am posting mine

For the first quote, These kinda statements shudn't be posted unless ur 100% sure of what ur talking abt!

Also, U told the experience of ur brother n not ur experience on Linux. May I know why? So from second quote, ur definitely not talking about ur views (opinion) ! U have formed ur views (opinion) based on views of some other person. In this case ur brother! Don't get offended, but how sane is that in a debate n talking about other's views n not ur views?

So the second quote definitely contradicts ur earlier posts! And I don't see u posting ur opinions well!

Likewise I can also say absurdly that mah friend said Mac is good for nothing and is a trash n a waste of money! How sane wud it be? I hope u got mah point!

So I hope that from now onwards, u really put ur views here and not ur brother's or someone else's!!

 

[aryayush]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

LOL! That was the funniest post ever.

I am short of experience on the Linux platform, which is why I started this topic, so it's is totally reasonable that I post experiences of others whom I am in contact with. And it is the truth. I don't see the harm in voicing the troubles one cousin of mine is facing on this forum.

U have formed ur views (opinion) based on views of some other person. In this case ur brother!

Doesn't everyone do that? Is it not normal? If your doctor tells you you have a stone in your kidney, will you cut it open yourself so that you can form your own opinion? You can't be everything and you can't experience everything - so you have to take others' word for it. It's perfectly normal behaviour, mate! You, for example, have never used a Macintosh but if someone asks you about it, you will surely quote some of points made by the likes of mail2and, goobimama and me. Why? Because we live in a social environment and have to depend on a lot of other people.

You find the statement, "Oh c'mon! Don't kid yourself." less than friendly? You are being oversensitive, friend.

And you want to hear my experiences with Linux, right? Well, here goes. I don't remember which distro it was but the first Linux distro I ever tried had a KDE desktop. It installed properly and I had no problems whatsoever with it. However, when it first ran, it did not recognise my mouse. I tried to navigate it with the keyboard for a while but knowing nothing about Linux and without any knowledge of the keyboard shortcuts, it was pretty useless. I uninstalled it.
The next one I tried started installing fine but stuck midway while trying to configure my CD-ROM. I tried the installation quite a few times but in vain.
Then I tried Ubuntu and Kubuntu. Both had to be started in safe graphics mode but they installed and worked fine but try as I might, they would not connect to the internet. (And you call Linux VERY easy? Why is there a topic in this forum itself dedicated to connecting DataOne on a GNU/Linux desktop? Why does doing such a simple thing require help on Linux?) Their 64-bit versions just stuck on the first loading screen which has the logo and never even started with the installation on my friend's 64-bit PC (and it is my opinion because I was doing the installation for him, or at least trying to).
Then I tried OpenSUSE. The installation worked after three tries but worked smoothly in the third try. However, the partition setup was a pain in the a**. When everything was installed properly, I booted it up and after a lot of greek lines of text, it showed a loading screen for a long time - and then everything became haywire. You ever seen a TV with malfunctioning antennae? It strongly resembled that.
Now, I tried to install OpenSUSE on my MacBook Pro. It installed and worked fine on Parallels. Then I made a partition for it on the hard drive and tried to install it. It never moved past the partition screen. I tried Ubuntu and it completely messed everything up. I tried to install it on my external hard drive and it formatted my whole drive even though I had clearly selected the option of resizing it (but I had made a backup, so I did not lose my 70+ GB of data). I tried to install it alongside the Windows installation on the internal hard drive and it first formatted the drive and removed Windows (contrary to what I had asked it to do again) and then told me that it was not possible to install it. Why, in the name of Merlin, couldn't it have provided me with that helpful information BEFORE formatting the drive? Or better still, why couldn't it have left the Windows installation alone!
And why does every Linux installation take so much time to bootup and shut down? There appears a lot of text telling you that everything is OK, OK, OK, Enabled, etc. It is very very irritating.

That, my dear friend, is my story about my Linux experiences. It is not exactly a bed of roses. Some of it must have been my fault but the fact remains, that Linux has still a long way to go before it becomes truly user-friendly. People should not have to take a backup of their hard drive before trying to install Linux on it. You may say that all this happened because I am a newbie and must have made some mistakes, well, I am a newbie to the Macintosh too but it has never formatted any of my drives against my wishes, network connection was a snap, sharing that connection with Linux and Windows was equally easy, the mouse has never stopped functioning, there have been no distorted screens and no trouble at all, in fact.
But it does not mean that I don't like Linux or will never try it again. I genuinely appreciate what the open source community has managed to achieve with Linux and the advancements (such as XGL/Compiz) today are really mind-blowing. But when there is a discussion between which is better: Mac or Linux, you know what I will opt for. It is simply THE best platform for computing IMHO. It has brains and brawn too!

 

[mediator]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

I simply told that you need 2GB of RAM if you want to run Parallels properly. It is a software that allows you to run Windows or Linux on a Macintosh simultaneously along with Mac OS X. Apart from that, it is pretty content even with 512MB of RAM. Of course, the more you throw at it, the more snappier it'll be, as any OS will and should.

I didn't ask about running parallels or running Linux and windows as guest OS on mac. I asked about running MAc on Vmware and parallels. And u said nething below 2 GB wont do justice! So can I run MAc on VMware and parallels with Xp or Linux as HOST OS with my currently 512 MB RAM?

Because having to install the operating system is part and parcel of the end-user experience. I don't know about you but I always prefer to install any OS on my machine myself. Maybe you are a lazy goon who thinks he is above such menial tasks, but I am not.

Awww! Its not me who thinks that installation is not a work of end-users buddy! But its the world of computer engineering, the IEEE representation and the world of software engineering that thinks so!
There are many type of users :

1. End-users
2. System maintainers
3. Developers
4. Testers and unit installers

So If u have read the books or have even a little bit of knowledge in the world of computing u'll probably know what I'm talking about!

U started the thread about end-users buddy, so don't mix the tasks of various users. Just talk about end-users.

As for the highlighted part, that again ur ignorance! So read the books n then tell what is part n parcel n of what!! Please don't give ur expert comments specially in the field of software engineering!

As if I did not post my own opinion! As if there is something wrong with posting someone else's opinion! As if you never quote another person when posting on this forum itself!

Still talking rubbish?? Even when I enlightened u about ur own absurd doctor's example?? Now who won't get piised off with these kinda thought of urs??
I tried to make u understand n requested u to have ur own independent personal outlook. But then, I can't help u beyond that.
Try debating like that with ur views based on other's view in each n every debate in real life. At the end of such debates u'll always remember me n that I warned u of having such mindset!! U'll know in ur life when u grow mature what I'm talking about!

As for highlighted part, I never do that without experiencing the scenario myself or if the person is professional enough to be trusted not like ur noobi brother. I told u shud have brains to judge to whom to follow n whose words to take. U like to repeat statements n make others repeat too. Don't u??

Just because I am not as well acquainted with it as with Windows or Macintosh, does not mean that I am ignorant about it. And if I not well acquainted with it, the reason is that I never quite managed to get it working perfectly on my machine which prevented me from using it for long periods.

It seems u have habit of eating cooked food! If so then try propreitary linux, that shud close ur mouth completely!
If u value money try fedora 6 or Ubunty edgy or mandriva 2007! It will take u like 1-2 hrs to make ur system complete with all the entertainment softwares + propreitary codecs installed. AS for the ease its there.

And dood acquaintance is of 2 type : practical n theoretical. Theoretical acquantance don't count in such debates ( I hope I don't have to elaborate this for u now. Even gx wud wud understand this ) . That leaves practical acquaintance and since u have not used linux personally for long periods n dont have well practical acquaintance then that certainly means ur ignorant about it.

Now check what I said n what u have written absurd! I have given proof of ur absurdness. I dont call neone absurd talker for no reason.

I am not sitting out here to entertain thy holy highness!

Thanx for the complement. Thats the best complement

NEWSFLASH: My cousin gave me the verdict that Linux wasn't very user-friendly and I tried it out - guess what, this amazing thing happened - I agreed with his opinion!

NEWSFLASH : My 4 yr old little sister asks me all the time "What to do?" when she sits on MAC. What u think I shud do?? Tell the world that MAC is not userfriendly or educate her??

Yeah, I can surely see that. Friendliness is bursting out of you!

Thanx!

You know what, you have a twisted mentality. If you don't know something about a subject, you should admit it (as I did) and you should speak out your opinions and listen to others too. That is, if you want to learn about the subject at hand.

Can't u read English?? Or someone here told u that mah post is written in Farsi n u believed him again? I already told plethora of times I'm learning about MAC here n as highlighted I already admitte it. Well who's having twisted mentality that everybody can surely see here!

Sooo u give ur opinions without getting acknowledged and enlightened about the subject???? U must be the first one dood. U surely amuse me! Can't mock u further here now! U just crossed the threshold of insanity giving new records!

Are you blind? No seriously, do have some severe physical or mental problem? I expressly mentioned that I have installed Ubuntu/Kubuntu many times, don't you understand such a simple thing.

And where did I stated that u installed it only one time???? Are you blind? No seriously, do have some severe physical or mental problem? Can't u understand n see such a simple thing?? U need a glass of water boy! First ur talking ignorant n absurd n then speaking further to support it! U'll get terribly mocked. I request u to stop ur words here only!

As for the Macintosh, they are not supposed to be installed on ordinary PCs because Apple has restricted that. It is supposed to be installed only on Apple hardware and it does that perfectly. It gets installed in six clicks of the mouse - just six clicks. Of course you can't expect that from Linux because it is made to cater to every sort of configuration, but it should at least get installed without harming the user's precious data.

What r ordinary PC's man?? PIII's?? Do u need a super computer to install MAC?? Do u need to be rich?? The supporting platforms by an OS also marks the improvement of an OS my friend!! Now what will u say?? That u don't believe that outta ur ignorance??
Study software engineering,IEEE etc. U'll know what I'm saying n then tell what u believe!

It was pre-installed but I have installed it myself too.

Seriously??

Yes, and I am not in the habit of doing that either. I clearly read all the options, went through instructions from online sources too before doing the partitioning. And I have installed Windows (98, XP and Vista) more times than I care to count but I never had a problem with the partitioning of my drives. I am quite adept at doing it. And if some OS made it difficult for me to get the partitioning correct, it is the operating system's fault, not mine.

U failed even after reading online instructions?? . Now that raises questions on ur intellect!! That u can't even follow simple online instructions! Neways if MAc was easy to install for u then Fedora 5 n Ubuntu 5.10 n Ubuntu Edgy were easy for me!
Ofcors problems exist everywhere n solving those problems (even the simplest ones) only makes u efficient in computing.

Hey, piss off man! What sort of a sickly retarded person are you anyway? I don't have a problem with Linux, OK? And I don't need to lie about anything to prove anything - and specially to people like you! And what's up with bringing gxsaurav up in every single post? Why do carry grudges with you all over the place? I bet you even tell your friends about how you had a fight on an online forum and gloat about it. You are re-defining the word 'sadist'!

Calm down man, I don't need to tell mah friends that the world is filled with morons like one I'm debating! There better things in to talk about. We like to enlighten each other practically n we don' make ignorant and absurd statements!
World is filled with people who can't classify n like to follow others n believe wateva other's say. I don't have time to talk about such trash people!

No, I don't. It is Apple's policy and they are free to practise it. It is how they ensure that their customers get a fully compatible and rock-solid operating system, fine-tuned relationship between the hardware and software and they have to sell their hardware too.

Now thats an example of fanboyism!! Talk about end-users experience buddy, why r making pathetic excuses outta topic??

And who gives you the right to judge whether I had used my brains or not?

Ur symptoms are judging u!! Do u ask the same question to doctor also?? Now what will u say "I'm a doctor"???

What do you think of yourself anyway? You think only you are sane here, only you got a brain, sicko?

Give as much personal comments as u want and u'll see I'm indeed friendly!!

The last thing I need to learn from you is vocabulary. I have never commented on it but your language sucks, man. Every post you make is riddled with grammatical and usage flaws. I can whip your a** right off you if you want to take me head-on is a competition of language skills. Bring it on, su**er!

Where are the topic related replies man?? U can't provoke me like that! Neways when ur dad requests u to talk and act sanely, u reply him as highlighted??

I have tried Ubuntu 6.10 and OpenSUSE 10.1. So don't speak about things you are not sure of (as you have kindly advised me tens of times in your previous post)

I expected such reply. Seeing all ur posts neone,even a kid can decide how honest n sure u r!

Not only is that a very un-gentlemanly post with lots of insults and harsh words, it is very repetitive too! If you had to scream your guts out at someone, couldn't you at least have come up with a few more and better words? Is that the best you can do? Shame on you!
If you scour through every post I have ever made on any online forum (barring this post), you won't come up with as many expletives as you have used in one single post. I think it is perfectly justified if I have gone a bit overboard with the strong words in this post, given your response to my polite posts and I do not give a damn if any action is taken against me due to this post!

Where is the topic related posts man??

Since these are the only few lines in your previous post which sound as if they were written by a normal human being, I would like to congratulate you for these!

Now, I was very friendly and I spoke politely but when you call a person stupid (or his opinion absurd) fifty times in a single post (now don't count it up and post the exact figure in the next post and claim that it wasn't fifty!), you lose the right to be respected yourself!

Thanx for the personal comments!

Neways for each n every absurd post of urs I have given the proof and showed u where u were acting ignorant. Also I didn't explicitly said that u were stupid. But I guess u desperately and affirmly want me to say that!


And how many times u saw that finger before u posted it there for others to see it?? Very amusing! Entertain me more!

 

[mail2and]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

Firstly, mediator I'd like to point out that Apple does not sell you the software. They're primarily a hardware company, and they bundle an OS with their hardware.

Secondly, I used Linux before I bought my Mac Mini. I can install Ubuntu, whereas my father can not. Linux, as a whole, is coming up in a big way, but saying that it is as user-friendly as other OSes is wrong. You might understand Unix, but in an non-IT office, why would you want some one to use the terminal, even if it is for 1 command.

As for Mac installation, no you don't need to understand partitioning. OS X makes the whole disk a single partition, as a default. So, people who don't understand stuff, and have no reason to either, can install OS X without a problem. OS X is designed in such a way that a joe user can do anything without ever knowing what the terminal is, while an advanced user can use the terminal to do every thing. Linux is getting there, which is commendable for a community-based OS, but the fact remains that it is not there, yet.

Don't believe me? Ask GNUrag.

The installation is as simple as Next/Next/Next. Someone had posted OS X installation screenshots in Digit.

I found your point that OS X takes more RAM on a virtual machine very strange. First, you are not supposed to install it on a virtual machine. It is illegal. Second, it is true of every OS. This is because you're running an OS on top of another OS. I've run OS X natively on a HP laptop(don't ask me how), and it ran perfectly well on Celeron M 1.4 ghz and 224 mb ram(32 mb shared with vid card).

 

[aryayush]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

I bet you have a penguin idol in your house and you pray in front of it everyday, don't you, mediator?

All of mail2and's points are true and exactly what I was trying to tell you. If you have a problem with his post too, go ahead, flame him too - let's see how much pleasure you can juice out of it!

Firstly, mediator I'd like to point out that Apple does not sell you the software. They're primarily a hardware company, and they bundle an OS with their hardware.

Yes, but they do sell Mac OS X, iLife, iWork and Final Cut Studio Pro seperately too, andy. Of course, it is ony permissible to be installed on Apple hardware.

 

[mediator]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

Hi @andy

Firstly, mediator I'd like to point out that Apple does not sell you the software. They're primarily a hardware company, and they bundle an OS with their hardware.

I hope aayush can enlighten me like that!

Secondly, I used Linux before I bought my Mac Mini. I can install Ubuntu, whereas my father can not. Linux, as a whole, is coming up in a big way, but saying that it is as user-friendly as other OSes is wrong. You might understand Unix, but in an non-IT office, why would you want some one to use the terminal, even if it is for 1 command.

I understand! @Andy the picture of linux u have formed in ur mind is of free Linux isn't it? Now if u want something for free, u ofcors have to do a little hardwork to make it complete. And spending 1-2 hrs to make it complete isn't too much I guess. Now tell me have u ever used propreitary linux so as to say the same??
As for the higlighted part thats the case with not only with ur father but almost everyone's father! Honestly tell if ur father can install even Windows?? Almost everyone's father today depend on their kids today for the installation part! Ur 20 yrs of age. ANd Most of Today's fathers for our generation aren't used to computing well. My father knows only MS-Word,shutting windows down and starting it up! I hope u understand!
Next the picture of mah BBA friend. He ask me to install even windows for him!
I agree Linux is coming up in a big way. And most people who like to experiment with OSs are people like us! But in the past 3 yrs I find the Linux installation has become extremely easy! Check out in open source, many people today say its a piece of cake! Its my own judgement that the installation part has improved dramatically!
As for the commandline I already discussed that with aryayush who njoyed by replying with personal comments instead! PLease do reply to what I said about commandline!

As for Mac installation, no you don't need to understand partitioning. OS X makes the whole disk a single partition, as a default. So, people who don't understand stuff, and have no reason to either, can install OS X without a problem. OS X is designed in such a way that a joe user can do anything without ever knowing what the terminal is, while an advanced user can use the terminal to do every thing. Linux is getting there, which is commendable for a community-based OS, but the fact remains that it is not there, yet.

Most linux installations make "whole disk a single partition, as a default". Most becoz I'm not aware about other distros! They might be doing the same. So whats the difference between that and MAC's installation?? AS for the rest I have already discussed that in context of commandline! Do reply to that! All u said is same with today's linux, but neways do reply to what I said earlier!

Don't believe me? Ask GNUrag.

About Linux or Mac? If its for Linux then any person who has used modern Linux distro wud say the same as I'm doing! Gnurag wud do the same. I'm well experienced on Linux. Why shud I consult other person neways?? If ur talking about MAC, then no need for that. I believe u!

Neways I hope that atleast u know the classification of the user category and I hope u know that installation part isn't the task of end-users whose experience this thread is dedicated to.

The installation is as simple as Next/Next/Next. Someone had posted OS X installation screenshots in Digit.

Well the Ubuntu installation is also next next next if u want the whole hdd to be made as single partition.

I found your point that OS X takes more RAM on a virtual machine very strange.

Nope thats not my point. Thats what aryayush told me when I asked him in WIn Vs mac debate! Read it!

First, you are not supposed to install it on a virtual machine. It is illegal.

It may be illegal. But I just wanna know if it can be installed or not!

I've run OS X natively on a HP laptop(don't ask me how), and it ran perfectly well on Celeron M 1.4 ghz and 224 mb ram(32 mb shared with vid card).

That's not fair now! I wanna experience OS X too. So educate me with the "how" part! I wud prefer installation on VMWare!


@aayush

I bet you have a penguin idol in your house and you pray in front of it everyday, don't you, mediator?

Now thats nice, after such debates mediator is coming in ur nightmares tooooo that u see him with a penguin idol?? That really amuses me. Nemore story to tell?? Please write some 10-20 stories like this one in ur next post. Thanx for entertaining me. Please continue.

All of mail2and's points are true and exactly what I was trying to tell you. If you have a problem with his post too, go ahead, flame him too - let's see how much pleasure you can juice out of it!

Thats a nice one! Where did I started flaming bro?? Can u quote to prove ur words??
Do u find words like "absurd,ignorant" offensive????? Have u ever debated with ur teacher or father or neone in real situation???? U'll find these words very common. Do u watch TV debates atleast?? Ur ignorant about debates too!!

Now in those debates with ur father, teacher n neone try using words "U must be kidding" n wateva u used in successive posts. DOn't know about "neone" but ur father n teacher will surely leave u with black eyes and red face without teeth!

If u have a little bit brains, u'll probably understand what I'm talking about!!

Yes, but they do sell Mac OS X, iLife, iWork and Final Cut Studio Pro seperately too, andy. Of course, it is ony permissible to be installed on Apple hardware.

Means extra money has to be shelled out for some additional software?? like MS??

So @aryayush, If u ever go mature n come out of ur world of childishness then please do reply from my posts in which u ignorantly n absurdly thought that words like "absurd,ignorant" are offensive!

 

[mail2and]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

Next the picture of mah BBA friend. He ask me to install even windows for him!

Well, I'm a B.com guy.

Most linux installations make "whole disk a single partition, as a default". Most becoz I'm not aware about other distros! They might be doing the same. So whats the difference between that and MAC's installation?? AS for the rest I have already discussed that in context of commandline! Do reply to that! All u said is same with today's linux, but neways do reply to what I said earlier.

Well, you've to install OS X to know the difference I've installed Slackware, Ubuntu, Fedora, Windows, Linspire, Mandriva, Lycoris and Zenwalk . I can tell you that OS X installation was by far the simplest. As I said, search for Tiger installation screenshots. You'll get quite a few on the web.

That's not fair now! I wanna experience OS X too. So educate me with the "how" part! I wud prefer installation on VMWare!

It's a bit of a pain. I forgot how to install(Well over 1.5 yrs ago). You can find the vmware image on torrent sites. The install guides had been taken down quite a while back.

Means extra money has to be shelled out for some additional software?? like MS??

Apple give iLife and OS X free with Macs. Some movies edited/made with iMovie have been screened at Cannes. *www.mysanantonio.com/business/stories/MYSA110506.2R.themacguy.188d302.html

As for Final Cut Pro, it's a professional video editing software, which is used by movie studios. It's not meant for an individual. *

 

[mediator]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

Well, I'm a B.com guy.

My point was that people are scared to install the so called "most user friendly and easy OS". They find problems in that too !

Well, you've to install OS X to know the difference I've installed Slackware, Ubuntu, Fedora, Windows, Linspire, Mandriva, Lycoris and Zenwalk . I can tell you that OS X installation was by far the simplest. As I said, search for Tiger installation screenshots. You'll get quite a few on the web.

U may be right. I don't question that! But very very easy and easy are different things. If noobies n other people can install Ubuntu n all the distros u said without any hint or help, then don't u think its easy enough??

Linux is primarily a server OS n developing fast into a desktop OS. It may even beat MAC OS X in "very very friendliness" thing in near future witnessing the huge improvements done in last 3 yrs alone! But if noobies n other people say that today's Linux is as easy as windows or even easier than windows, then don't u think thats a big complement to OSS developers??? Don't u thinks thats easy enough?? MAc may be easier, but today Linux is easy too!

It's a bit of a pain. I forgot how to install(Well over 1.5 yrs ago). You can find the vmware image on torrent sites. The install guides had been taken down quite a while back.

Please hand over the guides if u find them!

Apple give iLife and OS X free with Macs. Some movies edited/made with iMovie have been screened at Cannes. *www.mysanantonio.com/business...y.188d302.html

As for Final Cut Pro, it's a professional video editing software, which is used by movie studios. It's not meant for an individual. *

Yea that comes in cost part! But u can't deny that this scenario resembles to that of MS. Neways we r discussing about end-users experience as requested by aayush and defied by himself who talked further than end-user thing!

 

[JGuru]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

@Mediator, Here is the Mac OS X v10.4 Installation & setup Guide Click here
I agree with @Andy here. Mac OS X is the most easiest O.S to install of all the O.Ss
including Windows & Linux!! One of my friends has a Mac. Linux installation is also
getting more simpler with each release. You can see in this forum itself, lots of Linux
noobs installing Linux with little help.

 

[mediator]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

It may be easy, I'm not at all questioning that! But just trying to remove the myths people have about Linux today. And thats what I said, Linux is getting easy that even noobies r njoying it!

 

[aryayush]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

@Mediator, Here is the Mac OS X v10.4 Installation & setup Guide Click here

That guide won't help him. It is the one Apple officially distributes for installing Mac OS X on Apple hardware.
mediator needs the guide made by people who manage to get Mac OS X running on regular PCs.
__________

It may be easy, I'm not at all questioning that! But just trying to remove the myths people have about Linux today. And thats what I said, Linux is getting easy that even noobies r njoying it!

If you remember it, the discussion centered around which was easier, not whether Linux is easy or not.

 

[mediator]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

@aryayush

mediator needs the guide made by people who manage to get Mac OS X running on regular PCs.

Correct if it can be done or else for VMWARE!

If you remember it, the discussion centered around which was easier, not whether Linux is easy or not.

Correct! Knowing that u defied ur own request?? Read the previous posts if u forgot what I'm talking about!
Neways u commented nothing about my reply for commandline except for personal comments ofcors!

 

[mehulved]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

@aryayush. Ubuntu has warned that defualt partitioning formats the entire disk. Well all the OS'es I know of do that. From what Andy said, I got that even Mac does that. And even windows does that AFAIK.
But, you can do manual partitioning and tell it which partition to format, which not to, which to mount, where to mount and all. Installer won't touch that partition otherwise.
@mediator please leave gx out of this discussion, he's not here and anyways there's no talk of windows here.
GNU/Linux has an aim of being user friendly, but the thing is that these distros are released by the community. And on what basis are these communities formed? Mostly these people are Free Software entusiasts, who don't really prefer any proprietory softwares in the distros. So, what you have is a distro lacking of some commonly used proprietory softwares. So, it will make life difficult for the end users. And the community is not going to change this stance and compromise with the proprietory software makers just for a short term goal of increasing the user base. Rather they will stick to something that has got the linux where it is today - the opening of the source. In FLOSS community, the openness of the source is one of the biggest things and it makes a lot of sense. As of what I have read about the history of computers, the earliest years where computers were evolving, code sharing was the main reason the use of computers could become widespread. If in the earlier years, the codes of those softwares would have been hidden we'd never have a computer industry so wide spread.
One of the most common example I give is tcp protocol. tcp protocol was released under BSD license so everyone could freely use it, see it's source and modify it as per their liking. Now, MS has taken up that code, made changes and is trying to put up it's proprietory code of the tcp protocol as defualt so it can edge others out of the competition. Something of a similar sort is going on with ssl, again under BSD license.
I know this is quite off topic. But, the point I am trying to make is that proprietory softwares are a big hurdle in the way of development of linux or any open source OS. Whereas MS and Apple don't have to face it, since they have no such policy.

 

[mediator]

Re: Reasone for a Mac user to make the switch to Linux.

^^^^ AHhh correct! I shudn't have done that. I apologize to gx for that!
__________
Since we don't have many MAC users here, I feel some sources shud be attached to this thread matching its meaning! I hope aayush consents that!
Here are some recent MAC and linux threads I found where people posted their experiences!

*www.oreillynet.com/mac/blog/2004/02/open_source_vs_mac_vs_windows.html
*news.zdnet.com/2100-9590_22-5406365.html
*sekhon.berkeley.edu/macosx/

The authors have posted their experiences followed by others who have commented on that and gave their experiences as well.
Please do find such recent sources n post it here if u like the idea!