Oho, I didnt say mATX cant make gaming mobo.My point was that the standard was more suited to HTPCs which are compact.
I have had my share of mATX so I know...
I have had my share of mATX so I know...
PC Buying Guide - July 2011
- Thread starter Jaskanwar Singh
- Start date
-
- Tags
- 20k 35k buying rigs suggestions
- Status
Cilus
laborare est orare
But for cheap configurations, where both Sandy Bridge mobo and processors cannot be accommodate properly within budget, this mobo is a bliss as it has all the goodies packed. All the other mobos, which are actually little costlier than it are actually having 2 ram slots. And it is a very good alternative of H61 mobos, too.
Extreme Gamer, the usability of a Mobo depends upon the layout of the components in the motherboard. If they are properly placed then there won't be any problem. in my motherboard, the SATA ports are rare facing and as a result even the graphics cards are covering SATA ports, I can still attach/De-attach them without removing the card.
But in my previous mobo, as the SATA ports were upper facing, I was not able to use three of the five SATA ports.
Extreme Gamer, the usability of a Mobo depends upon the layout of the components in the motherboard. If they are properly placed then there won't be any problem. in my motherboard, the SATA ports are rare facing and as a result even the graphics cards are covering SATA ports, I can still attach/De-attach them without removing the card.
But in my previous mobo, as the SATA ports were upper facing, I was not able to use three of the five SATA ports.
Sarath
iDota
The lengths are the internal clearance which can be expanded a little more by removing the HDD cages.
The cable management was done at the shop itself. The routing option (if you mean using the holes on the back panel) was used. I will try making it cleaner next month. I am not(at all) very good at tinkering inside the cage.
At 85k and 100k I think a 23"/24" monitor will be better to make use of the extra hardware prowess. Especially since that is the only output of the system (apart from speakers) around which our computing experience revolves.
The cable management was done at the shop itself. The routing option (if you mean using the holes on the back panel) was used. I will try making it cleaner next month. I am not(at all) very good at tinkering inside the cage.
At 85k and 100k I think a 23"/24" monitor will be better to make use of the extra hardware prowess. Especially since that is the only output of the system (apart from speakers) around which our computing experience revolves.
OP
Jaskanwar Singh
Aspiring Novelist
@all
guys i expect you to reply on configs too. some changes? more comments on cases and psu used etc etc.
Buy Gskill RAM | G Skill Memory | G Skill 4GB RAM | Gskill India
thanks for that cilus. will look into it now.
what has a core i5 to do with htpc?
a athlon II x2 + 880g + 2gb ddr3 + 6470 is more than sufficient i think.
thanks for info.
so 6950 can fit in Lexa S.
Sub 85k (High end gaming)
Component
|
Make
|
Price
Processor
|Intel Core i5 2500k|11500
Motherboard |ASUS P8Z68 V PRO|13500
RAM |G.Skill Ripjaws X F3-12800CL9D-4GBXL|2600
Graphic Card |Sapphire HD6870 * 2 Crossfire|22400
HDD |Seagate 1TB 7200.12|2700
DVD Writer |LG 22X SATA DVD|900
PSU |Corsair TX650 V2|6300
Case |NZXT Lexa S|4400
Monitor |DELL ST2220L|8700
Mouse |CM Spawn (With Free Mouse Pad)|2200
Keyboard |RAzer Arctosa|2000
UPS |APC 1.1KVA|4300
Speakers |Altec Lancing VS4621|3200
| Total |84700
comment please.
guys i expect you to reply on configs too. some changes? more comments on cases and psu used etc etc.
Buy Gskill RAM | G Skill Memory | G Skill 4GB RAM | Gskill India
thanks for that cilus. will look into it now.
Aah !! Playing SafeEt Tu Brutus
what has a core i5 to do with htpc?
a athlon II x2 + 880g + 2gb ddr3 + 6470 is more than sufficient i think.
thanks for info.
so 6950 can fit in Lexa S.
Sub 85k (High end gaming)
Motherboard |ASUS P8Z68 V PRO|13500
RAM |G.Skill Ripjaws X F3-12800CL9D-4GBXL|2600
Graphic Card |Sapphire HD6870 * 2 Crossfire|22400
HDD |Seagate 1TB 7200.12|2700
DVD Writer |LG 22X SATA DVD|900
PSU |Corsair TX650 V2|6300
Case |NZXT Lexa S|4400
Monitor |DELL ST2220L|8700
Mouse |CM Spawn (With Free Mouse Pad)|2200
Keyboard |RAzer Arctosa|2000
UPS |APC 1.1KVA|4300
Speakers |Altec Lancing VS4621|3200
| Total |84700
comment please.
Sarath
iDota
Are you sure a crossfire is a good idea in the beginning giving no scope for future upgrades?
It might be VFM now but prices do fall so maybe a 6950/6970 now and another one a year later @60-75% of the original price.
Thats how I planned and so got a 6970.
Just my opinion.
And lexa S isnt as airy as say a HAF 912 or Tempest Evo or CM690(?). Although I dont know if the premium is justified.
From NZXT: NZXT :: Unique. Unprecendented. Inspired - Lexa S Product Detail
It might be VFM now but prices do fall so maybe a 6950/6970 now and another one a year later @60-75% of the original price.
Thats how I planned and so got a 6970.
Just my opinion.
And lexa S isnt as airy as say a HAF 912 or Tempest Evo or CM690(?). Although I dont know if the premium is justified.
From NZXT: NZXT :: Unique. Unprecendented. Inspired - Lexa S Product Detail
yep, better to include a single HD6970.
BTW, on the config Corsair TX650 V2 is 6.3k but a TX750V2 will cost that much - TX650V2 is around ~5.2k and core i5 2500k can be bought for as low as 10.5-11k - no way it's still 11.5k.
So with money we saved ( and by adding a little more ) we can add 2x 4GB Vengeance whic is around ~2.5k per 4GB module
BTW, on the config Corsair TX650 V2 is 6.3k but a TX750V2 will cost that much - TX650V2 is around ~5.2k and core i5 2500k can be bought for as low as 10.5-11k - no way it's still 11.5k.
So with money we saved ( and by adding a little more ) we can add 2x 4GB Vengeance whic is around ~2.5k per 4GB module
Cilus
laborare est orare
I've posted in support for Crossfire in one post of the Graphics card section: Again posting it here. Consider the case analysis:
suppose you've purchased a GTX 580 @ 30K, the most powerful single GPU solution, now how many days you are gonna use it....I think for 30K it should go for at least 2 Years. Now after 1.5 year, you've felt that you need another GPU as you are lacking the raw power. Now according to your upgrade option, you have to get another GTX 580 to SLI it.
If you look at the Gfx market scenario...the life span of a new high end product is just 8 months, then a more high end product will be available at the same price. But the interesting part is the price of the old component does not decrease that much in Indian Market.
Example: GTX 480 was launched @ 27K and withing 6 months GTX 570 is available @ 20K which delivers the same performance of GTX 480 @ 20K price point. But what is the price of GTX 480 now...still 24K
So the time when you are going for the SLI of GTX 580, say the price of it has been dropped to 20K from 30K. Now tell me are you gonna spend 20K for a card which is 1.5 years old and market is full of other cheaper products offering the same level of performance? Believe me, the upgrade path you are talking about is actually not a viable solution at all.
So get a GTX 460 and SLI it. Total cost will be still around 20-21K and you will get 5% performance over the GTX 580 in 10K less price. In coming days due to driver upgrades, you will get more better scaling in SLI and after 1.5 years or 2 years down the line, selling these two mid range cards won't hurt you that much as in case of GTX 580.
Now putting a HD 6870 CF will provide you even better performance (more than 10%) than a GTX 580. So I think you don't need to think about upgrades for 2 years. CF scaling is also getting better with the new driver upgrades.
And Jas, upgrade the prices as Topgear has suggested. These days, Corsair PSUs are coming really cheap.
suppose you've purchased a GTX 580 @ 30K, the most powerful single GPU solution, now how many days you are gonna use it....I think for 30K it should go for at least 2 Years. Now after 1.5 year, you've felt that you need another GPU as you are lacking the raw power. Now according to your upgrade option, you have to get another GTX 580 to SLI it.
If you look at the Gfx market scenario...the life span of a new high end product is just 8 months, then a more high end product will be available at the same price. But the interesting part is the price of the old component does not decrease that much in Indian Market.
Example: GTX 480 was launched @ 27K and withing 6 months GTX 570 is available @ 20K which delivers the same performance of GTX 480 @ 20K price point. But what is the price of GTX 480 now...still 24K
So the time when you are going for the SLI of GTX 580, say the price of it has been dropped to 20K from 30K. Now tell me are you gonna spend 20K for a card which is 1.5 years old and market is full of other cheaper products offering the same level of performance? Believe me, the upgrade path you are talking about is actually not a viable solution at all.
So get a GTX 460 and SLI it. Total cost will be still around 20-21K and you will get 5% performance over the GTX 580 in 10K less price. In coming days due to driver upgrades, you will get more better scaling in SLI and after 1.5 years or 2 years down the line, selling these two mid range cards won't hurt you that much as in case of GTX 580.
Now putting a HD 6870 CF will provide you even better performance (more than 10%) than a GTX 580. So I think you don't need to think about upgrades for 2 years. CF scaling is also getting better with the new driver upgrades.
And Jas, upgrade the prices as Topgear has suggested. These days, Corsair PSUs are coming really cheap.
nginx
In the zone
Agreed with Cilus. Considering you are paying 30k for a GTX 580, the performance gain is very little compared to a card costing 20k or even 15k. The law of diminishing returns has always applied to premium hardware i.e. the higher you go, the lesser the performance gain in regards to jump in price. I mean look at all the benchmarks of the GTX 570, HD 6970 and GTX 580 and you will instantly find out that you are basically paying paying 10k more for a 580 just to get 4-8 fps extra. Personally speaking, unless you have oodles of cash, you gotta justify the price you are paying for any product unless all you want is bragging rights.
At this point, GTX 560 is the sweet spot as far competitive pricing of gfx cards go. If you can SLI GTX 560 (13k), you would essentially get 10-15% more performance than GTX 580 and still end of saving 4k.
As far as pricing of old cards not going down in India. I don't know what could be the reason behind that. Is this because they fail to clear old stock due to lack of demands?
At this point, GTX 560 is the sweet spot as far competitive pricing of gfx cards go. If you can SLI GTX 560 (13k), you would essentially get 10-15% more performance than GTX 580 and still end of saving 4k.
As far as pricing of old cards not going down in India. I don't know what could be the reason behind that. Is this because they fail to clear old stock due to lack of demands?
Cilus
laborare est orare
^^ Good point. Actually a price tag of 30K for GTX 580 is not at all justified. Come on, a sub 20K HD 6850 CF config beats it easily. If I am getting the same or better performance in 19K, why should I go for 30K. And for future, I'm saving more than 10K. Just to purchase a gtx 580 to show "I have the most powerful card" is not acceptable. But obviously a lot of person want it to build a very powerful rig and want the highest end components. But that is personal coice and here we are providing most optimum solution...it should be based on Performance/Price ratio..to give a solution which gives unmatched performance at the price point, not to suggest a show-off config to put the highest end components without thinking is the extra money paid for it, really worth it.
And it is not only my opinion..check the tomshardware GPU section guides for every month...you will find they have suggested a multi-gpu solution over the single high end cards every time.
And it is not only my opinion..check the tomshardware GPU section guides for every month...you will find they have suggested a multi-gpu solution over the single high end cards every time.
Last edited:
Agreed. These days there's no point spending more than 15k on graphics card. The max resolution we game is rooted to 1080p across a wide range (22" to 27") of monitor size. Most of the PC games are console ports with support up to DX9 only, DX10 is virtually dead, and there's very few dx11 games which can push the hardware to its limit. And there's always the option of cheaper dual-GPU setup which only get more cheaper if you add the second card after 1-2 years by which time the high-end cards of previous generation simply vanishes from the market. So its much better to stick with mid-range parts for the time being.
@Jas, better suggest the high-end single GPU as optional upgrade.
@Jas, better suggest the high-end single GPU as optional upgrade.
d3p
PowerHouse
@Cilus: Good explaination. in India, the price drop for GPU happens rarely or just next to impossible.
BTW is it really feasible enough to SLI 580 under single monitor setup. What kind of noticable perfomance increment User can observe by running 580 SLI for single monitor setup.
Price point of view, the guy with 100k budget always look for a Single Fastest GPU for single monitor setup[may be 6970 or 580's]
Sadly, I hardly find user using Multi Monitor Setup. If thats the case then 6950, 6970 or even 6870 will be pretty handy instead of opting for 580 SLI.
Probably Extreme Gamer can answer this query, as he has CF 2*3GB 580's for 27" monitor.
BTW is it really feasible enough to SLI 580 under single monitor setup. What kind of noticable perfomance increment User can observe by running 580 SLI for single monitor setup.
Price point of view, the guy with 100k budget always look for a Single Fastest GPU for single monitor setup[may be 6970 or 580's]
Sadly, I hardly find user using Multi Monitor Setup. If thats the case then 6950, 6970 or even 6870 will be pretty handy instead of opting for 580 SLI.
Probably Extreme Gamer can answer this query, as he has CF 2*3GB 580's for 27" monitor.
Cilus
laborare est orare
Ya, lets extreme gamer answer it...in fact he can put a competitive analysis as he has all kind of setup available with him...very powerful single GPU, most powerful single GPU in SLI. So how much difference you are getting from these different setup, he can enlighten us.
And one thing, we buy powerful GPU to run future games smoothly, not getting very high FPS. The reason is most of the display we suggest here normally have 60 MHz refresh rate @ 1080P resolution. So you will not feel any difference between 60 fps and 75fps.
Regarding multi-gpu setting, I think a lot of people are skeptical for the performance gain and complexity of the setup. Let me clear that thing.... I am also in the Multi-GPU business very recently and my thinking about it was like most of the people...:CF is very complex" But after reading so many reviews and inspired by Asingh (who is a perfect example about the power of dual GPU performance longevity) I actually gathered the courage to get the dual GPU setup...and believe me guys, it is damn easy with today's card. With regular driver updates and supports from both nvidia and AMD, makes it a very stable platform.
I have a discussion with JAS regarding these dual GPU setup and our opinion is not to put any single GPU card costlier than 20-22K....the extra money is not justified.
And one thing, we buy powerful GPU to run future games smoothly, not getting very high FPS. The reason is most of the display we suggest here normally have 60 MHz refresh rate @ 1080P resolution. So you will not feel any difference between 60 fps and 75fps.
Regarding multi-gpu setting, I think a lot of people are skeptical for the performance gain and complexity of the setup. Let me clear that thing.... I am also in the Multi-GPU business very recently and my thinking about it was like most of the people...:CF is very complex" But after reading so many reviews and inspired by Asingh (who is a perfect example about the power of dual GPU performance longevity) I actually gathered the courage to get the dual GPU setup...and believe me guys, it is damn easy with today's card. With regular driver updates and supports from both nvidia and AMD, makes it a very stable platform.
I have a discussion with JAS regarding these dual GPU setup and our opinion is not to put any single GPU card costlier than 20-22K....the extra money is not justified.
I am building High end graphics/gaming machine. I am getting the machine assembled at one dealer in Mumbai & getting it delivered. If some components are not available with the dealer, can someone suggest replacements please?
For example-
Graphic Card
MSI HD6950 2GB Twin Frozr II/oc *2(CrossfireX) or MSI GTX580 Lightning
MSI cards are not available. Also, should I go for SLI or a single powerful card? Which one?
I am going for SSD instead of HDD for the system drive. SATA 2 or SATA3?
I will have 2/3 hard drives apart from system drive. With the suggested graphics card & everything, how much power will be needed? 600W? 750W? 1000W?
Please help!
For example-
Graphic Card
MSI HD6950 2GB Twin Frozr II/oc *2(CrossfireX) or MSI GTX580 Lightning
MSI cards are not available. Also, should I go for SLI or a single powerful card? Which one?
I am going for SSD instead of HDD for the system drive. SATA 2 or SATA3?
I will have 2/3 hard drives apart from system drive. With the suggested graphics card & everything, how much power will be needed? 600W? 750W? 1000W?
Please help!
1. See the discussions above. If you really want to spend 30k on graphics card alone, a single card is advisable. So here it is GTX580.
2. For SSD, look for only and only SATA3!!!
3. A 850W SMPS should be more than sufficient for your needs. But if you have the money, get a 1000W to avoid future upgrade pitfalls.
OP
Jaskanwar Singh
Aspiring Novelist
so this ok -
Sub 85k (High end gaming)
Component
|
Make
|
Price
Processor
|Intel Core i5 2500k|11000
Motherboard |ASUS P8Z68 V PRO|13500
RAM |G.Skill Ripjaws X F3-12800CL8D-8GBXM|5400
Graphic Card |Sapphire HD6870 * 2 Crossfire|22400
HDD |Seagate 1TB 7200.12|2700
DVD Writer |LG 22X SATA DVD|900
PSU |Corsair TX650 V2|5300
Case |NZXT Lexa S|4400
Monitor |DELL ST2220L|8700
Mouse |CM Spawn (With Free Mouse Pad)|2200
Keyboard |RAzer Arctosa|2000
UPS |APC 1.1KVA|4300
Speakers |Altec Lancing VS4621|3200
| Total |86100
Sub 85k (High end gaming)
Motherboard |ASUS P8Z68 V PRO|13500
RAM |G.Skill Ripjaws X F3-12800CL8D-8GBXM|5400
Graphic Card |Sapphire HD6870 * 2 Crossfire|22400
HDD |Seagate 1TB 7200.12|2700
DVD Writer |LG 22X SATA DVD|900
PSU |Corsair TX650 V2|5300
Case |NZXT Lexa S|4400
Monitor |DELL ST2220L|8700
Mouse |CM Spawn (With Free Mouse Pad)|2200
Keyboard |RAzer Arctosa|2000
UPS |APC 1.1KVA|4300
Speakers |Altec Lancing VS4621|3200
| Total |86100
Are you sure about that SMPS? I hope it will stand when someone needs to add another couple of HDDs. And regarding NZXT Lexa S, you have to remove the top fan if you go for an aftermarket CPU cooler. Similarly the DVD Writer won't go in the first slot without blocking the 2nd top fan. If anybody can let go the top fans then it is OK.
Sarath
iDota
Well that explains it well. I was of the opinion that the prices would fall in a year or so making it more feasible to add another card later.
I was not explicitly talking about the GTX580 as it is too expensive right now and not necessarily VFM. I am just talking about the upgrade path.
Its 10%gain in CF vs Single Fast GPU (with scope for future upgrades)? I think that would be a personal preference for many.
Waiting for Extreme gamers inputs. He has the most powerful rig I have come across.
Crossfired GTX 580s
I was not explicitly talking about the GTX580 as it is too expensive right now and not necessarily VFM. I am just talking about the upgrade path.
Its 10%gain in CF vs Single Fast GPU (with scope for future upgrades)? I think that would be a personal preference for many.
Waiting for Extreme gamers inputs. He has the most powerful rig I have come across.
Crossfired GTX 580s - Status