Why Security Pros Use Macs

[Zeeshan Quireshi]

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Yes and I totally "BELIEVE" you

You should

Does you pea-brain interpret what that means?

God damn...you are so stupid that if reality hit you in your head...you wouldn't understand because it would obviously be in ENGLISH!!! Honestly...you should go and kill your English teacher.

Wonder what's the situation now

PS: Eddie don't tell me now that you can debug without compiling the source code .

 

[Desi-Tek.com]

Ever worked on any program before? Here is an open challenge to any programmer in here (including you...if you are one). Download the source tar ball of Pidgin instant messenger (7.2 MB) and then from this source code...ask one of your friends to just go in and delete 5 random files. That is it...any 5 files from any directory. Now try finding which 5 files that person deleted and the function of these files...without running any compile or diff operation on the source code. If you can make "intelligent guess" and find those 5 files along with their function in this minuscule instant messenger source code...then I will believe that a programmer can actually find missing files from enormous source code of Windows!

P.S. You will have to explain in here how you found those files.

is it ok if i'll take help of my friend?
oh just noticed u said

diff operation on the source code

ah than it is very difficult

 

[eddie]

Whether you believe it or not doesn't makes any difference that Govermants can see Windows source code, & others can too upon MS permission

We have already discussed about governments and we really don't need to discuss "others" like you.

 

[gxsaurav]

Eddie, you sound like a compleately pwned user . You ask for proof or how we believe them, ahm...."screenshots"

 

[eddie]

PS: Eddie don't tell me now that you can debug without compiling the source code .

Your stupidity is so highly refined that it is hard to achieve the levels you have. I must congratulate you on reaching such high levels. You idiot look at the kind of source you are getting in 3rd Screenshot...ASP.Net Samples? DeviceEmulator? PowerToys??? Should I laugh in your face? That is "Windows Source Code" for you? By running debug operations on PowerToys...you will audit Windows core components? You are ultimately stupid!

I really have seen a nature's wonder in form of you...a human being living without brain!

ah than it is very difficult

It is impossible without diff...I can assure you that.

You ask for proof or how we believe them, ahm...."screenshots"

Yes screenshots with PowerToys in them...go out and play with them

 

[gxsaurav]

Microsoft spends billions to make Windows & its technologies. How do u expect them to give it or show to any user ? Goverment can see it if they provide legal reasons.

Licensed partners can see it to learn about Windows technologies & API to make there own product better.

Ya, in this regard Open Source is good, anyone can see the kernel source code (really?) & modify it. But here is the thing, this "anyone can modify" is the main reason linux is no where today. There is no standerdlisation

 

[eddie]

Microsoft spends billions to make Windows & its technologies. How do u expect them to give it or show to any user ? Goverment can see it if they provide legal reasons.

..are you out of your senses? Did you even read what we have been discussing all along? While Windows users have been claiming that Microsoft is allowing the world to see...compile and debug their source code...I have just been proving them wrong. If you are agreeing with me...then what the hell are you talking about pwnage? At least understand what a group is discussing before coming in and making a complete fool of yourself.

Licensed partners can see it to learn about Windows technologies & API to make there own product better.

That is it..."SEE"...not compile...not debug...not modify. Nothing!!!

 

[gxsaurav]

Did you read what zeeshan just said about Licensed partners compiling & modofying & using in there product or giving back to MS

 

[eddie]

Did you read what zeeshan just said about Licensed partners compiling & modofying & using in there product or giving back to MS

Yes and did you by any chance see what they can compile or modify? PowerToys! Now, You tell me that Vista is running PowerToys as its kernel and I will accept your arguments.

 

[Zeeshan Quireshi]

Yes and did you by any chance see what they can compile or modify? PowerToys! Now, You tell me that Vista is running PowerToys as its kernel and I will accept your arguments.

well the first and the second screenshot refer to access to Windows Source Code

Students can access Windows Source Code through the Windows Curriculum Resource Kit

Also , All the programms that r shown in first and second screenshot r the different types of ways to get access to Windows Source code

that is why i asked that did u ever visit the Shared Source Site .

i provided the third screenshot to extend that microsoft provides source of component other than Windows Source Code Too .

Ya, in this regard Open Source is good, anyone can see the kernel source code (really?) & modify it. But here is the thing, this "anyone can modify" is the main reason linux is no where today. There is no standerdlisation

Saurav , MS also provides access to windows kernel n whole windows source code , the first 2 screnshots show different programs n access levels to see , and modify windows source code .

 

[eddie]

well the first and the second screenshot refer to access to Windows Source Code

No they do not. They just refer to the kind of programs offered by Microsoft while 3rd screenshot proves the kind of code provided under those programs

Students can access Windows Source Code through the Windows Curriculum Resource Kit

You know what CRK is?

The CRK provides PowerPoint presentation slides, experiments, lab descriptions, sample quizzes and assignments for introducing case studies from the Windows kernel into operating system courses.

*www.microsoft.com/resources/sharedsource/Licensing/CurriculumResourceKit.mspx
...and that is Windows code? Just shows that you don't do what you preach. Your own so-called research is half baked

Also , All the programms that r shown in second screenshot r the different types of ways to get access to Windows Source code

No they are just ways to access the source code of programs mentioned in 3rd screenshot. A common user cannot get them otherwise

that is why i asked that did u ever visit the Shared Source Site .

This is why I asked you...did you ever go to school?

i provided the third screenshot to extend that microsoft provides source of component other than Windows Source Code Too .

If only they actually provided the source code for compilation

 

[aryayush]

Whoa! Easy with the smileys, buddy! 8)

 

[praka123]

what I understand that M$ will not give u the win source code even if ur Bill's son!if he got any?..
even if M$ says its win source code?can u compile it to make windows vista...how can u believe closed source?
M$ cannot open its doors even for its gr8est devels.that's it.
hey hey win geeks answer!dont quote the crap as someone did.
@eddie kudos on getting this l@mers the treat they loooong want.I know its human not to accept defeat-thats for windows creepers!FOSS is the future.

 

[eddie]

Whoa! Easy with the smileys, buddy! 8)

What to do dear...the guys in here try to create an effect by using smileys in almost every line (no matter if they belong there or not). I was just trying to make them realise that it is wrong but I doubt my efforts will bring fruit

@praka: I don't want to defeat anyone. Just wanted to clear the fact that there is a HUGE difference between audit ability of Open Source and Closed Source software.

 

[Zeeshan Quireshi]

No they do not. They just refer to the kind of programs offered by Microsoft while 3rd screenshot proves the kind of code provided under those programs

Oh yeah , then what's this

Enterprise Source Licensing Program (ESLP) The ESLP allows eligible enterprise customers access to Microsoft Windows source code for internal development and support purposes, including debugging. This enables customers to develop and support their internally deployed applications and solutions that run on Windows.

now this is plain simple english , dunno what excuse you will make this time

In the same way , other programs too allow Access to Windows Source Code for different types of clients .

 

[eddie]

now this is plain simple english , dunno what excuse you will make this time

Excuse? LOL! Here is the quote directly from ESLP page

With the Enterprise Source Licensing Program (ESLP) benefit, eligible customers with 1,500 or more licensed desktops can access Microsoft Windows source code for internal development and support. Your IT staff can use the source code to make adjustments and improvements to systems and related applications, enabling them to improve debugging, help maintain security, and help protect against viruses and other computer hazards.

The debugging being talked about is debugging of their "internal applications". Not of Windows Source code...time for you to improve your "research skills" and understanding?

Here's more

Benefits

Access to Microsoft source code through the ESLP benefits enterprise customers by:
• Providing insight and a deeper understanding of Windows.
• Facilitating security and privacy audits and maintenance of customer's computing environment.
• Enhancing performance tuning, thereby allowing customers to adjust and optimize their own systems and related applications.
• Enhancing the pre-deployment engineering process for enterprise environments.
• Improving internal support and troubleshooting capabilities of deployed Windows systems.
• Improving the feedback mechanisms that ultimately contribute to the development of better Microsoft customer solutions and tools for the future.

EVERYTHING is related to customer's OWN SYSTEMS. Nothing related to Windows source code audit or debugging

 

[amitava82]

The ESLP provides a mechanism for delivering source code for released versions and service packs of Windows 2000, Windows XP, and Windows Server 2003 operating systems. (No vista)

Use and Restrictions

• Licensees may use the source code for the sole purpose of assisting in the support and development of internally deployed products for the Microsoft Windows platform, ongoing support of Microsoft Windows deployments, and internal security audits of the Microsoft Windows operating system.

• Source code may not be used to assist with the development of a commercially distributed product.

• Licensees may read and reference the source code but may not modify it.

• The license term is one year.

Eligibility Requirements:

Be a state /local (or similar) government organization in an eligible geographic market OR maintain 1,500 Windows seats (Windows 2000 or above) under one of the following:
• An Enterprise Agreement.

• A Select Agreement with Upgrade Advantage or Software Assurance.

• Enterprise customers must be headquartered in and access the source from an eligible geographic market.

• Sign the Non-Disclosure Agreement, Master Source Code Agreement and License Form.d and reference the source code but may not modify it.

from here

Well that clarifies everything... Will you fanboys give up?? Just admit the fact that you cannot access windows source code when ever or whoever wants to.. not to mention you have to pay millions of dollars to get it.

damn eddie, you are fast...

 

[eddie]

I was about to post that. You just took away all the fun Anyways, these are important points here

• Licensees may read and reference the source code but may not modify it.
• Sign the Non-Disclosure Agreement, Master Source Code Agreement and License Form

It clearly shows that you cannot do anything with the source code but "READ" it. Additionally you have to agree to the license that is applicable to Windows Library by signing a "License Form" and it has already been established in this very thread...that Microsoft's development libraries come under "Reference Only" license. So there is no question of compiling or debugging Windows source code

 

[Zeeshan Quireshi]

I was about to post that. You just took away all the fun Anyways, these are important points hereIt clearly shows that you cannot do anything with the source code but "READ" it.

I did not say that MS made windows open source . it allows companies to read , compile n debug windows code so that they can understand the internal workings of the Windows family and thus have a better understanding and can then develop software.
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[eddie]

I did not say that MS made windows open source . it allows companies to read , compile n debug windows code so that they can understand the internal workings of the Windows family and thus have a better understanding and can then develop software.

We have already established that Microsoft releases its devel libraries under Ms-Rl "Reference Only" license and every member of any program needs to accept that license by signing a form. There is no way any company can "compile" the "Windows source code" without breaking the license conditions.