The ISEET Discussion Thread

[tkin]

I know about these types that gobble down entire books, but when it comes down to thinking out of the box they fall behind, I have a good example, during accenture Aptitude test, we, the average students(7/8 pointers) got in while a lot of 9 pointers couldn't clear it.

If ISEET is applied, these idiots will get a chance.

One more thing, sometimes if someone does not perform good in IIT entrance he can take it next year after a lot of hard work and studying, ISEET entirely defeats this due to inclusion of board marks which will be fixed for your life.

 

[KDroid]

I know about these types that gobble down entire books, but when it comes down to thinking out of the box they fall behind, I have a good example, during accenture Aptitude test, we, the average students(7/8 pointers) got in while a lot of 9 pointers couldn't clear it.

If ISEET is applied, these idiots will get a chance.

One more thing, sometimes if someone does not perform good in IIT entrance he can take it next year after a lot of hard work and studying, ISEET entirely defeats this due to inclusion of board marks which will be fixed for your life.

Totally Agree with every word.


Press Information Bureau English Releases

 

[pramudit]

dont know why indian gov does these kind of big experiment... why dont they do things step by step¿¿¿
the gov tries to imply everything at once rather than thinking on it first and doing things step by step...

 

[pamitm]

All you people who think this will reduce the quality of students entering iit think again. I feel this will do much good because now people who have some logical thinking capability will now enter instead of some rote experts. people with proper communication skills will enter.

 

[tkin]

All you people who think this will reduce the quality of students entering iit think again. I feel this will do much good because now people who have some logical thinking capability will now enter instead of some rote experts. people with proper communication skills will enter.

Yes, someone who can speak good english should enter IIT, and they will go on to become sales managers, oh, wait...........

People who have good logical thinking get good marks in objective type questions, people who does not have even one ounce of logical reasoning ability but can gobble down entire books and vomit them out do good in theory exams(board), guess who should enter IITs?

Another example, my friend got an 18 rank in WBJEE, 99 in AIEEE but his marks in 12th was mediocre at best(bengali impaled him).

If this is to be applied only take int consideration science marks.

 

[AcceleratorX]

Like I said, the optimal method is to introduce conceptually oriented subjective type questions. Note that I said conceptually oriented, because normal subjective type questions will benefit only rote learners.

Conceptually oriented questions should revolve around applications of theories, logical conclusions on a test case scenario using some theorem, sum solving and multidisciplinary questions (get rid of the separate physics/chem/maths sections and mix them all up: make questions that force you to use all three to some or the other extent).

As for English, I think language proficiency is important but only to some extent. So, the marks of the candidate in English/Hindi/Bengali, etc. should not matter once it is beyond a specific threshold (let's keep that at something like 60 marks, not so hard to get and not too easy either). Once this minimum threshold is reached, only science marks must matter.

 

[KDroid]

ISEET renamed back to IIT JEE, pattern of the examination will be new

because of legal problems.

Conceptually oriented questions should revolve around applications of theories, logical conclusions on a test case scenario using some theorem, sum solving and multidisciplinary questions (get rid of the separate physics/chem/maths sections and mix them all up: make questions that force you to use all three to some or the other extent).

__

Why does one need to study Physics & chemistry if he wants to be a coder in India? Unfair.



You are suggesting to make questions that use all of the three. I appreciate it.


What if a particular person is very good at Mathematics, but not at Physics & Chemistry. In current scenario he can get good marks in Maths & manage to get average marks in Phy. & Chem. But in the suggested pattern, his performance will fall.

 

[AcceleratorX]

Why does one need to study Physics & chemistry if he wants to be a coder in India? Unfair.

Regarding usage of PCM score for computer courses: Yes, that is a little unfair. However, as all candidates cannot be assumed to have studied something related to computers beforehand (i.e. till 12th), these PCM marks get considered for the sake of "equal opportunity". I think a lot of people don't agree but I'm not seeing a better solution here.

What if a particular person is very good at Mathematics, but not at Physics & Chemistry. In current scenario he can get good marks in Maths & manage to get average marks in Phy. & Chem. But in the suggested pattern, his performance will fall.

Actually, I think it will actually work to their favour rather than not. A candidate who has good concepts in even one of the three subjects will be able to think along the lines of the question and hence answer it as per his respective subject.

For e.g. if I give a question to calculate a gradient for a potential function represented by a vector U. The gradient is a very simple derivative in 3 dimensions.

Now let's add some physics to the question: Make that potential an electric potential. Let there be a space and a point at which a force is acting.

For a person strong in physics: This is a question in electromagnetics.
For a person strong in mathematics: This is a question in vectors and vector derivatives.

One way or another, the numerical value of the answer will be the same. The person strong in maths will call it a function, the person strong in physics will call it work done or gradient, etc.

I think there's a real chance for this method to work, and most importantly, since such questions will involve the real-world applications, coaching classes will have less of an effect. Thus, a really brilliant student will shine.

 

[pamitm]

Yes, someone who can speak good english should enter IIT, and they will go on to become sales managers, oh, wait...........

People who have good logical thinking get good marks in objective type questions, people who does not have even one ounce of logical reasoning ability but can gobble down entire books and vomit them out do good in theory exams(board), guess who should enter IITs?

Another example, my friend got an 18 rank in WBJEE, 99 in AIEEE but his marks in 12th was mediocre at best(bengali impaled him).

If this is to be applied only take int consideration science marks.

Well tkin if you look at some boards like isc where roting gets you nowhere. so roting for board exams is only for some boards. also this will reduce in less dependence on coaching classes. and remember the weightage it is 40% for the theoritical "roting" exams. This is a welcome change for people who dont like "mugging" for iitjee as is tought in coaching classes.
And about the english speaking skills, people join iit's & nit's not to learn something new or because they like engineering or research but for getting a good package after the pass out. So communication skills are the real differentiators here.think about the alumnis from iit. who amongst them is known for research. among the most famous ones is chetan bhagat who is not even close to engineering anymore. so iits= good pay package. and for keeping it companies on to pyou need to know english. otherwise iit pass out is as good as any other worker on the line.

 

[pamitm]

The education system is becoming retarded like the us, in no time our students will become dull like americans, oh wait..........!!

Calling the education system in US retarded is a retarded thing to do. the teaching style in the us makes studying a joyous process. Also the topics tought are far more advanced than in India. In the US the start right up from the basics and make even the toughest concepts feel like a breeze.infact if any problem exists it is in india part of wich gets rectified by iseet.

 

[KDroid]

economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/news-by-industry/services/education/hrd-ministry-reaches-out-to-iits-to-clear-doubts-on-iseet/articleshow/12540647.cms

 

[thetechfreak]

Guys the question remains.
1. Is the new 40% scheme implemented? School claims it already has been
2. Seeing lack of activity is it safe to say that 2013 will have both entrances separately?

 

[mastercool8695]

the second one needs an answer urgently...

i also do think same..
the iit's have already said that iseet in 2013 is possible only with minor changes , and this is not to be considered as any minor change..

^^ are an aspirant ??

 

[thetechfreak]

Yes. Got to class 12 recently. Will be appearing my boards and other exams next year. It seems there is nothing concrete with both my questions. Pretty sure noting has changed?

 

[KDroid]

There are minimal chances of this system getting implemented in 2013. I recently read somewhere that the meeting between the HRD & IIT professors ended with no result. HRD said that they will form new commitee. IITs also said that they will come up with a new pattern for single entrance. I also read that the meeting of IIT profs regarding the new pattern got postponed from 23 April to somewhere in June. Have been following this closely.

Will post proper links when I'm on PC.

Not perfect, but better than coaching wankfest.

It won't put an end to coaching 'wankfest' at all.

 

[thetechfreak]

In my opinion since everything is still in discussion process this is not happening next year. Period.
And no coachings wont close down after this gets implemented

 

[mastercool8695]

^^ exactly man..
ikjactli
hehehe

cuz when they have wasted so much time on the iseet discussion , and the iits finally ignoring it.. as if a student goes to the princi and tells " sir , the hindi teacher sucks , get him out of the school" or , "what about 10 maths papers instead of the hindi one ??"

in fact , i'have thought of the second one many times..
its great ..
dont ya think ?

a simple solution is :
1. Get all the schools into the cbse curriculum within 1.5 years. (as half year is already lost now..).
so the level of all the students will be increased. and then the competitive exams will select the bestest minds of the best
this is to be done step by step :

Spoiler

steps are :
1. Order the boards to start cbse curriculum with the year starting 2013
2. the students will surely get adjusted with the cbse syllabus within 1.5 years
3. so the final exams in the year 2013 (end) should be fully cbse oriented
4. done.

2. Untill then the students with the old syllabus (board wise syllabus) can get into any institutions as of now..

3. and as the cbse curriculum is all over india from the session starting 2014 , implement the ISEET.
until then they will have the time to do some good changes with the ISEET like the ones suggested in the thread (some of 'em are just awsum and will increase the student's minds greatly)

NOTE : this all looks very good to us untill I/(most of you) think about the fact that if the government had wanted to do any good , it would have done it far before.
There are lots of great minds in the govt today also.
they keep making great mechanisms for the development of the country and its studs. but.
"MOST OF US WILL NOT GET THE CHANCE TO SEE THIS CHANGE"



reread the last line..

 

[AcceleratorX]

The issue is very simple, every change is influenced by the thought of "will my son/daughter be able to cope with this". This is why change is slow and filled with resistance, because everyone fears for the future of their children.

Unfortunately the entire country's future is at stake when such decisions are to be made, thus your own children shouldn't be the only defining factor.

Side note: There is no such thing as "bestest of the best". Being a student involves more than just the knowledge. Your discipline, behaviour and overall conduct matter and should be a part of the admission/interview, especially for postgraduate degrees.

A test can never objectively determine who is the best because you have too many random variables: backgrounds, preparation specifics, ability to make sense of what is being taught, etc.

Thus, it is wrong to say that a test will select the best minds, because a good mind should be balanced in all respects, not just specific subject knowledge. What's best also differs depending on whose opinion you take.

For example, I may score very well and consistently come in the top 10 ranks in my degree, yet in my own opinion my friend with 50% marks and KTs to boot has more aptitude, skill and interest in building devices and machines than me. But the test says I'm the better mind. Who will agree?

Where do you draw the line then?

 

[KDroid]

^^ exactly man..
ikjactli
hehehe

cuz when they have wasted so much time on the iseet discussion , and the iits finally ignoring it.. as if a student goes to the princi and tells " sir , the hindi teacher sucks , get him out of the school" or , "what about 10 maths papers instead of the hindi one ??"

in fact , i'have thought of the second one many times..
its great ..
dont ya think ?

a simple solution is :
1. Get all the schools into the cbse curriculum within 1.5 years. (as half year is already lost now..).
so the level of all the students will be increased. and then the competitive exams will select the bestest minds of the best
this is to be done step by step :

Spoiler

steps are :
1. Order the boards to start cbse curriculum with the year starting 2013
2. the students will surely get adjusted with the cbse syllabus within 1.5 years
3. so the final exams in the year 2013 (end) should be fully cbse oriented
4. done.

2. Untill then the students with the old syllabus (board wise syllabus) can get into any institutions as of now..

3. and as the cbse curriculum is all over india from the session starting 2014 , implement the ISEET.
until then they will have the time to do some good changes with the ISEET like the ones suggested in the thread (some of 'em are just awsum and will increase the student's minds greatly)

NOTE : this all looks very good to us untill I/(most of you) think about the fact that if the government had wanted to do any good , it would have done it far before.
There are lots of great minds in the govt today also.
they keep making great mechanisms for the development of the country and its studs. but.
"MOST OF US WILL NOT GET THE CHANCE TO SEE THIS CHANGE"



reread the last line..

There are big holes in your suggestions. Don't have time to point 'em out now. Will do that tomorrow!

 

[mastercool8695]

^^ must be buddy.. cuz they are not from any Education Planner.. they come out of just a 12th standard guy who thinks that it would have been much good if the curriculum would have been same all over india.
an all - india unity curriculum will make all the students on par atleast in the case of syllabus.

@Accelerator X : buddy , what you are saying is correct.
i'was just hinting that the overall study level of indian students may go up as a result of the reforms..
the 'best' was to say that all the students may achieve a level of mind which we contemporarily call "the best". or atleast better..

thanks for pointing out the holes.. i was just typing what i think should be the reforms.

one more thing i wanna say. and please spread this to all you know. it would do better for the whole world (not just the nation..)

"PLEASE CHOOSE ONLY THAT THING IN WHICH YOU ARE INTERESTED."

just taking up science because one's family background is in science or their parents tell them to be an engineer or a doc.
its devastating for your life , as well as for the whole country indirectly.
suppose a person takes up science but his aim is to do an mba and work in a multinational firm and be a money making machine for 10 years.. (this is just an example . there are more than 1000 combinations that a student can have)
why are you wasting the Entrance seat ??

this came to my mind as a result of Accelerator X 's comment..

of all the iitians and aieee-ians i'hv ever heard of , 90 % have done MBA just because they were forced to iit by ther parents / family

the persont who do Mba after IIT , what makes you do that ??
you are thinking of science for 4 years and then go to a management school and end up wasting:
1. 4 years of your life
2. one seat in the engineering college. which a science enthusiast would have taken but couldn't just because he /she was not good at getting marks (but was ofcourse Grreat with their minds)
3. 4 years fees paid by their guardians (its not a small amount)

for the entrance exam :
i vote for one objective + one theory(concept tester) + interview method

the theory papers will be checked only if the student has got good marks in the objective paper

and rankings will be published more than the current ones. (more rankings means that the students who have good minds but dont have good marks - obtaining skills will also get a chance..)


the interviews will decide whether the candidate is allowed for admission or not..