imranais said:
Thats what I said all Indians are bound by same laws. A Muslim Killer gets the same punishment as a Hindu killer or any other killer. There is no differentiation at all. Except a few exceptions as I said which exists for different religions.
Bro, These are the few exceptions I'm talking about because of which there is divide between Islam and other religions. These are the few exceptions because of which most people think Muslims are terrorist minded, want to have separate country all the time, cant exist peacefully with other religions and cant coexist with National laws!
India was divided as I said because of these laws only. India at that time had much great percentage of Muslim population who wanted separate State. Who knows if population of Indian Muslims rises, there can be another partition.
And these are not exceptions, these are sparking points of communal tensions.
Everybody wants population of India to decrease so as to reduce all population related problems like unemployment,poverty etc. For this family planning was thought of. Why did the muslims oppose this? Arent they interested in contributing,solving national problems?
Most muslim families have not less than 3 kids. These families arent able to feed their kids. And then go poor. Then they say govenrment is not doing enough for them. Who is responsible? Them or the governemnt? If they follow laws equally dont u think it will be good for everyone? No more communal tensions I mean and no more population explosions.
Also to maintain equality dont u think subjects such as "Muslim Quota", "Muslim Reservation", "Muslim Vote" shud be abolished??
Dont u think the gap and partiality is rising enough?? Dont u think Muslims are being selfish to have everything for their comfort i.e first the exceptional LAWS as u said , second RESERVATION FOR MUSLIMS , third asking their community members to elect a governement of their common choice so that it will do more good for MUSLIMS ALONE i.e MUSLIMS VOTE ?? And at the end most of them still say they are suffering in India to gain some more priviledges and gain sympathy!! Dont u think its tooo much??
imranais said:
Has the disintegration happened in 58 years of India's independence? These exceptions in laws are part of Indian constition. And like I said in previous posts having UCC does not mean unity..
I dont agree with this!
Will u keep saying this until disintegration has actually happened? Its similar to thing that is lost. most people dont realise the importance of thing until its lost. And then try to get it back when its lost.
Isnt the history witness that we were actually partitioned? How u know it wont happen again?
5-10 years after partition everyone was sad. No communal tensions were there. 10-20 years the differences again started to rise. Now we see communal tensions every year! How can u be sure partition wont happen? Cant u learn from the past and be convinced until the partition has actually taken place? Its a different matter tha most of us dont want a partition, but how many broadminded/educated people are there in the country? or as @yamaraj said how many REAL muslims are there in the country?
imranais said:
I completely agree with u, but in Muslims drinking is a big taboo and as I said there are black sheeps in every religion, so muslims who drink or do other forbidden activities are not muslims at all or muslims only by name.
How can u say they are not Muslims? They must be practising Islam more than u do! Every mother says not to drink or smoke. But if a child does so, is he no longer her kid?
Most Muslims say interacting with other religion members is alo UnIslamic! So for them u must be UnIslamic then! As I said these are no laws but ethics. If think in broader terms, they are only loosing their ethics by drinking and defaming their families!
imranais said:
An Example: Suppose two sisters who are twins, and who are equally beautiful, walk down the street. One of them is attired in the Islamic hijaab i.e. the complete body is covered, except for the face and the hands up to the wrists. The other sister is wearing western clothes, a mini skirt or shorts. Just around the corner there is a hooligan or ruffian who is waiting for a catch, to tease a girl. Whom will he tease? The girl wearing the Islamic Hijaab or the girl wearing the skirt or the mini? Naturally he will tease the girl wearing the skirt or the mini. Such dresses are an indirect invitation to the opposite sex for teasing and molestation. The Qur’an rightly says that hijaab prevents women from being molested. And Burkha is to safeguard women and her modesty and in no way meant to degrade her. Women who do understand Islam will wear a Burkha even if her husband/parents stop her. Burkha is not a forced garment but a recommended garment.
imranais said:
There are only a few people who give comments about her, and these are the people who want to get fame by giving such comments or mediating in affairs where they are not even invited or required.
Nops, I disagree here again! If a sex hungry freak really wants to tease then he wont look for such things! Now let me rephrase ur example!
Suppose the burqa girl is walking in a lonely street full of sex hungry freaks. What will u think? SHe'll get out of there without any misery? Even a 3 month old child girl,a girl in saree or salwar kameez is raped these days so why will they care about Burqa?
And why arent there any dances and other happy thing in Muslim festivals except for feast? Dances,Living openly in the SUN during winters etc are some of things Women enjoy the most. Why is it most Muslim girls are so desparate to learn Bharat Natiyam? I'm not saying this, but I was surprised to see it on news channels some months ago. If u think I'm making stories then let me tell u I dont like to talk absurd and dont expect the same from opponent! Nobody must be reading and watching news like I do!
imranais said:
So u kill plants to eat them. Now u may say plants have less senses than animals so killing plants is ok compared to killing animals...
Neways u been talking and emphasising a lot on plants. I told u plants and animals are different categories and arent classified for no reasons!
So now let me tell u ......A living form is said to feel pain and suffering if it has a NERVOUS SYSTEM. Birds,animals,humans all have nervous systems. They can sense pain. On the other hand, Plants dont have NERVOUS SYSTEM. And yes they dont feel pain. This was not mine but a scientific definition.
( and this definition of plants having "no senses" is used in serials and cartoons to like "Flames of Recca". Watch it to get enlightened => Episode Number: 26, Animax, 8 pm,12 am or 10am
)
If they wud have felt pain then
1. cud u explain me the concept of autumn, why leaves themselves shrink and then reappear during springs.
2. Cud u explain me why dont the plant die even when break a branch of it?
3. Even if we take out from roots, it doesnt shred for 1-2 days??
List is endless! I can fill the whole page on this! So dont say plants have senses! As I said classifications like herbivore and carnivore, plants and animals, arent made for no reason and I told u to think about this ! Neways I told u now....I hope u wont feel pity for plants anymore. But yea every thing has its own importance. Plants provode us O2. So next time before cutting a tree think again
!
Some scientists say plants have life, others say plants dont have life. Some say it has life because it grows! Others say then NAILS,HAIR must be having life tooo as they can grow too after the person dies!
Neways vegetarian food also has POTATOES, CEREALS,BEANS and plenty of other things that dont have life at all !
I hope u got my point and i hope u wont argue to me or anybody now that plants are KILLED or HAVE SENSES after forwarding such a brief, to the point scientific lesson to u!
AND u shudnt talk about anything like plants on which ur ignorant! See I didnt talk about Sharia at all! Neways WHo told u plants have senses?? Muslim leaders/clerics??
imranais said:
If a person can survive without killing any living creature, I would be the first person to adopt such a way of life.
Now why did u say CREATURE urself???? Plants dont come under the category of CREATURE!! I hope u got my point. I told u to understand the difference between plants and animals and understand about their classifications. But u didnt!! This really lowers the spirit of a good,peaceful discussion.
I see u only brought "Plants" in the discussion to defend the slaughtering of goats though u were ignorant about plants!!
Yes a person can live without killing any living CREATURE by simply being a VEGETARIAN and eating beans,cereals,milk,potato........shud I make a list for u ????!!!!
SO ARE U READY TO ADOPT SUCH A WAY OF LIFE AND TELL OTHER MEMBERS OF UR COMMUNITY THE SAME???? U promised now, dont take a U-Turn from ur promise as it wud be UnIslamic
!!
imranais said:
Suppose your brother is born deaf and dumb and has two senses less as compared to other human beings. He becomes mature and someone murders him. Would you ask the judge to give the murderer a lesser punishment because your brother has two senses less? In fact you would say that he has killed a masoom, an innocent person, and the judge should give the murderer a greater punishment.
Bro, Can u please elaborate on the relevance of this example here??? Having the ability to feel/sense is different from having the ability to see or hear!!!! Dont be so confused!! DO I need to enlighten a guy like u on such a simple thing??
First in ur first post u talk about about wars and terrorism in the same meaning!! NExt u show the same confusion here ???
imranais said:
I do question about things and do not believe in blind faith. I even reasearch to find an answer. Also I believe in Islam not because I am born muslim but because it coincides with Logic and Science. With no offence to any other religion I can never believe that a Idol made by a human being to be God, God is something unimaginable we cannot create a idol, a picture or anything of him. And in Islam I have to only believe that there is only 1 God who has power to all.
Religion in YOUR definition is an organization and a set of rules as u say. So in ur definition I'm not much religiously devoted and wud like to die if I had such a religion made of rules that u had to follow! I dont visit temples much. For me my parents are like GOD to me. Its because of them I exist and continue to exist not because of ALMIGHTY!
So I wud like to make an idol of them or embedd them/their picture in my heart. So u see there is nothing wrong in idol worship. The one who u worship, u shud actually have a picture of him/her in u heart!
imranais said:
The basic difference between Islam and Hinduism which I believe is of apostrophe S ('s). Hindus say Fire is God, sun is God, Moon is God etc etc and Muslims say everything is of God's.
Who told u Hindus think like that??? Stupid serials??? U said Media is stupid to potray Muslims as terrorist! Then let me say Media is stupid for this tooo!
Islam is just some 1000-2000 yrs old religion (The prophet Muhammad (circa 570-632 A.D.) introduced Islam in 610 A.D.). But do u know, Hinduism is ALMOST as old as Earth?? U may laugh on this, as most do! U may say how ALMOST old as earth? But this is what he fact is. Hinduism is the oldest religion on the earth.( For me religion is not an organization but a form of spirituality based on facts ). And as time passes by, facts are twisted as u know! If ur grandfather says a secret like "Some sheep give wool" ( i know this is wierd exampl) and asks the coming generations to hide this fact in their minds, then ur great reat great......great grandson might get this fact twisted as "ALL sheep give wool". I hope u got my point.
So as generations passed by facts about Hinduism have twisted! So I only believe only in Epics,Mahabharat,GITA and the VEDAS!! As they are the only thing that are real now.
There may already be sme twisting in ISLAM already who knows!
To tell u Hinduism is all about 3 Gods : Brahma(the creator), Vishnu(the preserver) and the Shiva (the destructor).
Some think whatever is happening in the world is just a dream seen by Vishnu! If anything wrong happens he takes avatars!
GITA says there are 10 avatars of Lord Vishnu!
*members.tripod.com/~srinivasp/mythology/avatars.html
Read this thoroughly!
It is said that everything that has an origin has an end also (It is also said that MAtrix was based on Concept of Hinduism). The earth timeline is categorised into yugs. There are 4 total yugs each one of some lakhs years. Nobody has been able to understand this mystery yet. Some scientists argue that a yug must be more than that. Some say Earths rortation must be faster at that time. Thats why so many years must have elapsed!
Believe me so fire gods and whateva u say are just twists! The real things I explained u above! And if u dont believe into anything blindly then u shud be aware of origin of ur religion, u shud have facts to prove that prophet actually had an angelic visitation etc!
For hinduism we have all facts scientifically explained! For mahabharat and exist of Pandavas there are temples dating back to 1000 yrs ago in uttaranchal, in high mountains of himalayas! For Ramayan, we have the path created of stones connecting SriLanka and India. During recent Tsunamis many statues dating back to 1000 yrs were found waved in by the Tsunami waves! In all cases carbon dating and other scientific methods,process was applied to prove that they were really old. One more thing, GITA says the last avatar of Vishnu i.e Kalki will appear during the end of Kalyug. And according to GITA and modern science this is the Kalyug where the violence will be at its peak!!!
Do u have the same scientific explanations and facts for Islam??
We still have a few Vedas with us, which explains the cure of diabetes and all other diseases of which cure still hasnt be found in modern medical field!!!! U see american scientists were baffled and still are when they acknowledge such things from Hinduism! AND now the westerners psychos who thought themselves as the smartest and greatest are now actually researching on these Vedic techniques. So u see Vedic techniques,Yoga etc existed long before any other religion came on earth and much long before Modern Science even started!!
So I request u to stop talking about the differences between Hinduism and Islam as I can write pages endlessly on this!
imranais said:
The difference is that Tantriks believe that God requires meat and Blood to accept their prayers and Qur’ân clearly states that unlike some other religions who believe that Almighty God requires meat and blood, in Islam when we sacrifice an animal neither the blood nor the meat reaches God but it is our piety, intentions, and righteousness while sacrificing that is taken into consideration.
That is the reason when a sacrifice of an animal is made during Eedul-Duha (Bakri-Eed) 1/3rd portion of the animal has to be given in charity to the poor people1/3rd has to be distributed amongst relatives and friends. A maximum of 1/3rd portion may be kept for the personal household consumption.
No portion of the animal's flesh or blood is kept separately for Almighty God, because he does not require it. Thus We dont slaughter a Goat and offer Meat and Blood to God to please him.
Yes here I agree, u think right about tantriks. U said u werent blindly follwing ur religion. But then arent u blindly following ur religion now?? Why do u need to kill goat?? Just for religion??
Religions are started after the WISE preachings of someone. That someone doest tells us to slaughter animals like goats or celebrate by burning crackers in his WISE preachings! Its only us who do so! DId prophet told to kill goat?? So how will u term this now except for BLIND FAITH ?? If this is not following ur religion blindly then what is it??
imranais said:
Exactly it does not bring happiness but what is lawful to be eaten can be eaten and should be eaten....
If every human being was a vegetarian, it would lead to overpopulation of cattle in the world, since their reproduction and multiplication is very swift. God in His Divine Wisdom knows how to maintain the balance of His creation appropriately. No wonder He has permitted us to have the meat of the cattle.
Overpopulation of cattle?? So u started eating it?? What about DOGS and PIGS and CROWS?? They are also getting overly populated. Their multiplication is also very swift. GOD has also provided u with flesh of DOGS and PIGS. U'll find dogs every next street! So shudnt u be EATING them on this concept of urs ????
If u believe in this CONCEPT of urs blindly then shudn't u soon also be starting to eat the social animal i.e MAN and if u classify further on basis religion then a MUSLIM MAN (as they multiply more than any other religion and most have families not less than 3 kids)????
Dont get me wrong! But will u stop for a moment and stop thinking like "God in his divine wisdom or whateva". If u think God wants a balance then why dont u eat PIGS too and DOGS too? Do u want to deplete the earth of one specific animal category i.e cattle and disrupt the balance that the GOD in WISDOM wants?? In ur language I say "GOD has Given us the most important thing i.e the BRAINS to think whats wrong and right and made us the dominant species on earth" and "GOD wants u to use that brains to think harder and stop following what other say"!!!!
imranais said:
Thanks for reading my replies line by line too... Plz let me know if I unintensionally hurt any of ur feelings, If I did then I sincerely apologize.
Oh well! Guess our last lines are always the same! Do apologise me too If I hurt any of ur feelings !!! Thanx for reading and quoting my lines line by line. Lets continue this debate!!
CHeers!
