Indians and privacy
- Thread starter Desmond
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theterminator
Wise Old Owl
Are we seriously not having a discussion regarding privacy concerns about the Aarogya Setu App?
SaiyanGoku
kamehameha!!
I've gone through some twitter posts. Govt. is trying to make it seem like privacy is irrelevant when it comes to protecting lives of millions.
They have mandated it for private and public employees to install the app. This is reaching China's level of spying on its own citizens.
theterminator
Wise Old Owl
I've gone through some twitter posts. Govt. is trying to make it seem like privacy is irrelevant when it comes to protecting lives of millions.
They have mandated it for private and public employees to install the app. This is reaching China's level of spying on its own citizens.
Yeah like come on...they are forcing all employees to install an app that records GPS activities ... instead they should invest heavily on healthcare infrastructure and removing unnecessary hurdles when claiming insurance.
Nerevarine
Incarnate
The true victims are people with zero knowledge of privacy, old people, bhakts, kids, teens etc.
bssunilreddy
Chosen of the Omnissiah
Why do members in forums always speak about bhakts?
It's feels like something is being pierced into the heart.
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theterminator
Wise Old Owl
coz its an app by modi govt .. had it been by congress govt then bhakt would be replaced by andhbhakt
Nerevarine
Incarnate
Bhakts are a major demographic to install this app willingly, like it or not.
if this app was externally audited and open source, I would have no issue with it.
But as it stands govt has a lot of potential to misuse it.
It's important to ask questions, during these trying times. Govt is a service provider, nothing more. Don't attach emotion to their actions.
if this app was externally audited and open source, I would have no issue with it.
But as it stands govt has a lot of potential to misuse it.
It's important to ask questions, during these trying times. Govt is a service provider, nothing more. Don't attach emotion to their actions.
OP
I take it you identify as a so called bhakt that's why you are feeling bad. But you see, when someone calls others libtards, gaddar, etc. they also feel just as bad. Truth, however is that people are extremely polarized right now owing to what I can only call abuse of social media. The more polarized people become, the more friction is created and more such name-calling will happen. But this is just how things are right now. I understand how you feel but I don't think we can do anything about that because I doubt this will be the last time you hear someone blaming "bhakts" or "libtards".
On topic: I am aware about the whole Arogya Setu app debacle. From what I have observed so far is that people have been downplaying the ramifications of this. Making this app mandatory will have far reaching effects way beyond the current COVID scare. In fact I'd say the government is using the on going panic to justify installing an invasive app like this. Just the fact that the government can have your location at any time itself is scary. Lets say that after this COVID scare is over, the apps will remain and the government can still use it to track people. That is why I am against making it mandatory, but let it be voluntary.
Secondly, I'd be more comfortable with making it mandatory if the government publishes the source code for the app, both client and server, for the public to audit. This way we will know how the data is being used.
In fact, I think all software developed using tax payer money should be open source.
theterminator
Wise Old Owl
That's far away from reality as Mars is from Earth. Who thinks government is a service provider? Elections are fought emotionally. The politicians will try to make a situation (riots,murders,martyrdoms,etc) where the voter decides emotionally rather than rationally. The present govrnment has achieved Ph.D in this and continues to enjoy unprecedented majority even after economic disaster after disasters. Currently, I am seeing a trend of hardline Pro hindutva supporters advocating for Swadeshi products, especially in the wake of covid19. But when their darling government will pitch in FDI for Make In India, they will be the first ones to praise the 56 inch.
OP
Well, have have a history of pathos driven rhetoric in news since the beginning of time.
theterminator
Wise Old Owl
You would think that with time we would evolve.
OP
It's more about confirmation bias. That is people will only consume media that they confirms to their pre-existing beliefs. But let's not dwell on this now. Analyzing the biases of every demographic in India would warrant a thread of it's own. Let's stick to the topic for now.
theterminator
Wise Old Owl
*uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200504/45ac2bf758b201e8ed05037b6d883fe8.jpg
This mentions an anonymous govt source that govt might release source code soon.
This mentions an anonymous govt source that govt might release source code soon.
Nerevarine
Incarnate
Inb4 open sourcing it but releasing private/api keys to cloud back end..
OP
Lol. That would be the joke of the day. But I don't think anyone would be that careless, govt probably contracted some software development company to build this, so they should know how to share.
My expectation is that they should share the source code of both the client app and the server. Ideally with unit tests so that we can test the functionality ourselves.
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Okay forget terms of service, potential for misuse and lack of laws in India - because none of these are problems with the actual app. Focus on the capabilities of the Aarogya Setu app, and tell me one thing that is wrong with it.
-Bluetooth is for "chirps", same tech used for pairing, gives better proximity information to other devices, higher resolution than GPS which can be spotty at times
-Forcing people to install it or preinstalling it makes sense in a pandemic situation
-The data does not even leave the device and go to the server. If someone reports testing positive, then their info is sent to servers, and you get an alert depending on the data on your phone.
-They have even taken the extra step of encrypting the data that is stored on the device itself, not really necessary as such information can be gleaned even if the app is not there, but people have physical access to the device!
Overall, it is very secure and well implemented. Source code not being made public does not mean that it is not open source.
The closest thing to a real problem was exposing the details of the affected people on Government web sites, which caused their neighbours to shame and humiliate them, which is again a problem with the people, and not the app itself, but yeah, maybe their details should not have been publicly released.
For anyone accusing me of being a bhakt, just google "aditya madanapalle firstpost aadhaar" without the quotes. I made it my business to walk into office every morning and fight that battle for privacy.
-Bluetooth is for "chirps", same tech used for pairing, gives better proximity information to other devices, higher resolution than GPS which can be spotty at times
-Forcing people to install it or preinstalling it makes sense in a pandemic situation
-The data does not even leave the device and go to the server. If someone reports testing positive, then their info is sent to servers, and you get an alert depending on the data on your phone.
-They have even taken the extra step of encrypting the data that is stored on the device itself, not really necessary as such information can be gleaned even if the app is not there, but people have physical access to the device!
Overall, it is very secure and well implemented. Source code not being made public does not mean that it is not open source
. The closest thing to a real problem was exposing the details of the affected people on Government web sites, which caused their neighbours to shame and humiliate them, which is again a problem with the people, and not the app itself, but yeah, maybe their details should not have been publicly released.
For anyone accusing me of being a bhakt, just google "aditya madanapalle firstpost aadhaar" without the quotes. I made it my business to walk into office every morning and fight that battle for privacy.
OP
I honestly find it very hard to believe.
Besides, making the source code public is a good will move that will give them some trust and if the source code is clean then everyone will calm down.
And I don't support the "fundamental rights can be rescinded in case of crisis" argument because getting complacent now will have far reaching effects, way beyond the current coronavirus crisis.
My point is that, things like this should never be normalised, especially if government is involved.
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Besides, making the source code public is a good will move that will give them some trust and if the source code is clean then everyone will calm down.
And I don't support the "fundamental rights can be rescinded in case of crisis" argument because getting complacent now will have far reaching effects, way beyond the current coronavirus crisis.
My point is that, things like this should never be normalised, especially if government is involved.
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