Camera talk...
- Thread starter nac
- Start date
OP
nac
Aspiring Novelist
When I googled 'AF ON', many advocates to use this instead of shutter button including and esp. for moving subjects.
Since I don't have first hand experience, I am not able to understand how using two fingers is fast and easy when you can do that with just one !!!We can use continuous AF if people are not going to stay still and pose for us, right?
Yeah, that's a concern taking sharp photos with wide open aperture. Thinking 100mm can do two jobs, detailing and portrait. Weekend is just around the corner, I will be checking 100mm first and see how good it is for portrait.
Found a new site
Edit: typo
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raja manuel
In the zone
I have been using back button focus for several years now. There are several situations where it is an advantage, such as when you have people moving inbetween you and your subject. Lifting your thumb off the button will prevent the lens from trying to focus on the person (or whatever) and you can go back to pressing the button once they have passed, saving a lot of lens hunting time. This can be of great help, provided you know what you're doing, if you're trying to shoot the couple at a wedding and there are people continuously coming between you and the subject. For portraits, it is great when you need to focus and recompose - lock focus, lift thumb off button, recompose to get the framing you want, then click. The benefit in back button focus is felt when you struggle to keep the shutter button half pressed because you've taken hundred of shots with a heavy lens or flash or both on your camera and your hands are tired or when your camera keeps refocusing every time you half press ready to take the pic, but you don't have the moment yet. It is also a great tool when combined with focus tracking and burst mode. making it easy to get multiple shots of a moving subject which doesn't have to be a bird in flight, it could just be a bird walking across the dais
That said, there are some disadvantages as well. The angle at which your thumb presses the button is not very ergonomic and repeated focussing can cause pain in the joint where your thumb joins your hand. This has only happened to me a couple of times but it is something to watch out for and you should remember to let your thumb rest when you can and not ride the button. Another con is that the AF-ON button is stiffer than the shutter button (at least on my camera) and the force required to press it can jerk the camera - I've experienced this mostly when shooting in a downward direction when my hands are tired and I'm photographing something small with very shallow depth of field.
Overall, I've found using BBF to be superior when used as a part of a method i.e., I'm very comfortable using just one autofocus point and quickly changing the active focus point to the one I want, using focus tracking (I don't need focus confirmation) and being ready to use burst mode whenever I want. It just makes more sense for me to have this as the default setting and to switch out of it on the rare occasion when something else works better. I've used BBF extensively to photograph events, portraits, and food without any issues.
It did take me a couple of days to get used to it so I wouldn't recommend using it if you don't have much practise time before the wedding.
That said, there are some disadvantages as well. The angle at which your thumb presses the button is not very ergonomic and repeated focussing can cause pain in the joint where your thumb joins your hand. This has only happened to me a couple of times but it is something to watch out for and you should remember to let your thumb rest when you can and not ride the button. Another con is that the AF-ON button is stiffer than the shutter button (at least on my camera) and the force required to press it can jerk the camera - I've experienced this mostly when shooting in a downward direction when my hands are tired and I'm photographing something small with very shallow depth of field.
Overall, I've found using BBF to be superior when used as a part of a method i.e., I'm very comfortable using just one autofocus point and quickly changing the active focus point to the one I want, using focus tracking (I don't need focus confirmation) and being ready to use burst mode whenever I want. It just makes more sense for me to have this as the default setting and to switch out of it on the rare occasion when something else works better. I've used BBF extensively to photograph events, portraits, and food without any issues.
It did take me a couple of days to get used to it so I wouldn't recommend using it if you don't have much practise time before the wedding.
OP
nac
Aspiring Novelist
Hey! Are you professionally shooting?
Thanks for sharing your experience. I will try my hands on with AF ON button and see if I find it comfortable using it. Else, I can go back to the conventional method I am used with - Shutter button AF.
OP
nac
Aspiring Novelist
Got Yonguo 565EX along with the camera. I am seeing ETTL in review, but I couldn't able to get that. In this flash, it shows just TTL.
When I try to access flash menu in the camera, it says 'not compatible'. In TTL mode I set flash exposure from -5 to +5, I am getting the same exposure. I am shooting in Av mode, ISO Auto+ (1600).
If I shoot in manual (in flash), even @ 1/128th I am getting over exposed.
In review, LCD shows what zoom/aperture they are using. But I couldn't get mine to show that info. What should I do to enable ETTL?
When I try to access flash menu in the camera, it says 'not compatible'. In TTL mode I set flash exposure from -5 to +5, I am getting the same exposure. I am shooting in Av mode, ISO Auto+ (1600).
If I shoot in manual (in flash), even @ 1/128th I am getting over exposed.
In review, LCD shows what zoom/aperture they are using. But I couldn't get mine to show that info. What should I do to enable ETTL?
OP
nac
Aspiring Novelist
That's what I thought. But if camera couldn't get the exposure within the limit, it will override min. shutter speed and shoot @ slower shutter leaving me with the blurred image. I would rather take under exposed image. So if I don't want the shutter to go slower, I should stick with manual mode.
In the review, they are using Canon and it shows ETTL. With ETTL, flash knows what focal length, aperture I am using. May be it's different version of the flash, I could see some difference in labeling and buttons. Yongnuo doesn't seem like having detailed info or user manual for this flash or at least I couldn't find it.
Sometimes flash fires, sometime don't. I don't know what's the reason. Whatever flash exposure compensation I set in flash or in camera, I get the same exposure. I will ask the photographer in person and learn how to use this flash.
OP
nac
Aspiring Novelist
That's how I am shooting. Fortunately, ISO stays within the limit I set. Just shutter goes longer than I set.
I am not sure how to operate this flash right. In Av mode, even the fastest 1/128th in Yongnuo overexposes the scene. In liveview, external flash isn't working, or maybe it's the setting I don't know. Before figuring out that, it scared the shxx outta me.
After long use, my hands starts shaking. Out of tiredness I guess or may be I getting old
During playback, I set the AF point to show. I am using single point spot AF (center) and one shot (aka AF-Single). When I shoot, I lock focus and recompose and shoot. But the playback always showing the AF point is at center (I mean center of the photo, not the center I focused before recomposing). By the way, I am trying this BBF. I don't know if focus point is changed while I was recomposing or that's a flaw in the camera playback. I am yet to view the pictures in PC.
OP
nac
Aspiring Novelist
Found a workaround, since flash not reading the focal length I am using I have been setting it manually @ 105mm. Now I set it to 24mm, the intensity decreased. When pairing it with built-in diffuser or bouncing the flash, I am getting properly exposed scene (no more plain white scene).
raja manuel
In the zone
Nope.
If it is not compatible, it is working just like a manual flash i.e., only the centre pin will be active, sending the trigger to fire the flash. The camera will expose the scene for ambient light. When you add flash to that you will get an overexposed image.
Note that incompatible may only mean that you need to clean the contacts on flash/body.
This may be because the fash is effectively a manual flash. Minimum shutter speed setting may not work because the camera doesn't 'see' a flash.
What batteries are you using? If the flash is taking a long time to recharge it may not fire until its capacitor is full. The camera will take the photo anyway since the flash is not communicating with the camera.
Again, if it is effectively in manual mode, exposure compensation may not work. For ETTL (or any TTL) to work, the flash has to fire a preflash that the camera will use to measure exposure then send a message to the flash to set the correct exposure for the scene. Without this there is nothing for the flash to compensate for/from.
Non Canon flashes often don't work in Live View. A workaround that is reported to work with some flashes is disabling Live View Silent Shooting mode.
The camera will only record where the focus point is when the photo is taken. If the central autofocus point is active, it will always show the focal point in the centre of the image. This is helpful when a) you don't remember which focus point was active, and b) when multiple focus points are active and you want to see which one locked focus. It will not help you to identify where you focussed before recomposition.
From what you describe it appears that you are not reducing flash output but instead scattering the flash light thereby reducing exposure on the subject. If this is correct you must rectify this and actually reduce flash output or else you will find it very difficult to cover an event because a) you will keep running out of battery charge, b) the flash will keep shutting down due to overheating, and c) if the flash doesn't shutdown you will fry the flash. A fast moving event is a torture test for a flash and you should use flash power wisely.
General comment:
Rmember that even when ETTL works, the camera will expose for ambient and the flash is added to it. And despite the E in ETTL, you need to check which metering mode you are in, and understand how metering works or else you will get incorrectly exposed photos.
An ETTL metering workflow that works fairly well for Christian weddings (because the bride wears white which is a convenient reference point)
* Spot meter off the dress and take photo. Image will be severely underexposed. Dial in exposure compensation until the historgram is almost touching the right edge
* Now take all photos by spot metering off the white dress. You may need to set EC and FEC seperately for this to work well.
If you don't have white on the subject this can get tricky. You need to identify something that can be used as a reference point, then try to figure out where that should appear on the histogram and dial in suitable exposure compensation.
OP
nac
Aspiring Novelist
I better don't try cleaning that. I am afraid I would screw up something while cleaning.
Even if I am not using flash, that's the case. Camera overrides min. shutter speed I set and they have explained this in their 400+ page user manual which I read when I was digging online why the camera picks a longer shutter.
4 x AA Eneloop 2000 mAH
So camera works as it should, just that I was expecting something different.
What you said is right, one should conserve the energy. But 1/128th is the least I could go. I was shooting in Av mode, wide open aperture @f1/.8, ISO Auto+ (range 100-1600), Min. shutter speed @ 1/125th. Camera sets ISO at 1600 (that's the max limit I set) and camera overrides min. shutter and set @ 1/20th and scene is overexposed. I can set ISO range to 100-400, but again camera will set shutter much longer than 1/20th and still the scene will be overexposed. To get proper exposure in this scenario are, I can either shoot in manual mode (camera) or diffuse/bounce the flash.
I think the photographer keeps grey card. May be I can try that.
I tried the camera and the 3 primes. Couldn't try 50mm much. I spent most of the time finding how the things work and why they aren't working. Most of the shots are fired trying to find how the flash works and to know how different picture style looks. How to get that tack sharp images? I tried and tried, I am not getting. AF points are bigger than the eye when I shoot few feet away from the subject. There is no digital zoom in OVF, I can't always use liveview for that. Full-length, head shot, waist level all are not as sharp as I expected/wanted to be. It's not that it's miss focus (yes, if it's a tight head shot). Though picture looks fine at window size, when I look at pixel level it's not that sharp. I tried it in outdoor, fast shutter, low iso still that's the case.
Left one is from head shot (flash fired)
Right top is from waist level shot (flash fired)
Last one is from full length shot (evening sun light, yes it was harsh)
All are 100% crop
I thought background will be OOF with 85 f/1.8 full length portrait, but it isn't.
Next time I should give more distance between subject and background.*i.imgur.com/KAM9IZ0.jpg
raja manuel
In the zone
Have you read Canon's knowledge base on this topic? They address this specific issue.
NEW: User-controllable “Auto” for minimum shutter speed with Auto ISO
Another option for pre-setting the minimum shutter speed before Auto ISO goes to a higher ISO setting is “Auto.” In the past, this was simply 1/ lens focal length, and with standard or wide-angle lenses, the resulting slow shutter speeds sometimes meant speeds that were dangerously close to risking blurs from subject or camera movement. Think about it — in a fast-paced situation, such as (for instance) indoor wedding candids with a 16-35mm lens, do you really want speeds dropping as low as 1/15th of a second?
EOS 7D Mark II now offers a 7-step scale, to further fine-tune what the camera will do when you’ve set Auto for minimum shutter speed. It still uses 1/ lens focal length as the base, but with considerable adjustability. Three settings on the “+” side allow you to dial-in 1, 2 or 3 stops faster shutter speeds than whatever your current 1/ lens focal length setting is. And the “–” settings allow up to 3 stops slower speeds, for instances where you’re using Image Stabilization, or are otherwise confident that slower shutter speeds will be the right answer for you.
Particularly when working with zoom lenses having an extensive zoom range, the Auto setting gives flexibility to work with Auto ISO, and have appropriate shutter speeds for your longer focal lengths, and still allow for reduced — but safe — speeds at wide zoom settings.
Another option for pre-setting the minimum shutter speed before Auto ISO goes to a higher ISO setting is “Auto.” In the past, this was simply 1/ lens focal length, and with standard or wide-angle lenses, the resulting slow shutter speeds sometimes meant speeds that were dangerously close to risking blurs from subject or camera movement. Think about it — in a fast-paced situation, such as (for instance) indoor wedding candids with a 16-35mm lens, do you really want speeds dropping as low as 1/15th of a second?
EOS 7D Mark II now offers a 7-step scale, to further fine-tune what the camera will do when you’ve set Auto for minimum shutter speed. It still uses 1/ lens focal length as the base, but with considerable adjustability. Three settings on the “+” side allow you to dial-in 1, 2 or 3 stops faster shutter speeds than whatever your current 1/ lens focal length setting is. And the “–” settings allow up to 3 stops slower speeds, for instances where you’re using Image Stabilization, or are otherwise confident that slower shutter speeds will be the right answer for you.
Particularly when working with zoom lenses having an extensive zoom range, the Auto setting gives flexibility to work with Auto ISO, and have appropriate shutter speeds for your longer focal lengths, and still allow for reduced — but safe — speeds at wide zoom settings.
That should be enough. Perhaps the flash is sometimes dumping full power in which case it will take time to recharge no matter what batteries you use. Does this happen after you get washed out images?
A possibility here is that the flash is actually using much more than 1/128 power, but it is more likely that ISO 1600 and 1/20 of a second are the culprits. Also check what you're meteering off - if it something darker than middle grey the camera will try to overexpose.
Yeah, that's the right way to go about it.
Looking at this photo, it is clear that the eyebrow is razor sharp to the right so it is definitely a case of misfocus. It could be user error or lens front focus. Try in live view to see if you can get proper focus. If yes, it may mean the lens is front focussing - but if all lenses show this problem then you may just need to modify your technique.
I don't know about the others, though. It is a bit too much to expect that a full length photo will have sharp eyelashes.
Now you know why Canon makes f/1.2 lenses, and people still complain that is not enoughI thought background will be OOF with 85 f/1.8 full length portrait, but it isn't.
OP
nac
Aspiring Novelist
Thanks for the link. I haven't read this before, but again after hitting the max ISO camera picks slower shutter and it's explained in the link provided.
Yes, it happens and it gets washed out from full power to 1/16th
That's right. I am using spot metering and if I meter from eye it will overexpose.
Photographer already fine tuned AF with 100mm lens. And after getting the camera and lenses, first thing I did was if there is any focus issue using ruler. All the three lenses focused at the point I focused. So I think it's my technique.
Thanks guys. Last one week was like preparing for examination. I am still nervous. Packed and I am starting. I will let you know guys how it went after I come back. Wish me luck.
sujoyp
Grand Master
I would suggest dont use auto ISO ...or let it be equal to the speed your hand will shake and you get blurred image for your lens..for 85mm it maybe 1/100 and ISO 1600. Also I was searching for an example and I found out that I dont shoot at f1.8 at all...I start from f2.2 for humans.
are you testing flash without bounce/diffusion...I suggest using some diffusion...direct flash light is always strong on face
are you testing flash without bounce/diffusion...I suggest using some diffusion...direct flash light is always strong on face
raja manuel
In the zone
Break a leg!