Apple Previews Mac OS X Snow Leopard to Developers

[chandru.in]

+1 risc is faster than cisc....but then cisc provides more flexibility to the programmers.

Are there so many programmers still coding their programs in assembly? If they are using even C (the lowest level high-level language), they need not bother so much about the CPU architecture at all (except in very few cases where they absolutely have to embed asm code in C like in certain parts of OS and device drivers).

 

[FilledVoid]

No person in his right mind will buy a product seeing its brand name.

Just to point something out. Theres a good amount of research showing that theres a noticeable chunk of consumers who base their purchasing decisions just based on brand name.

Now that the topic is going way off course I think I'lll choose to stay off it .

 

[aryayush]

Yeah, well, you could’ve chosen to ignore it. Several months of such diatribes with gx_saurav has made me an expert on that.

As for that comment, his whole post is completely unrelated to the point I was trying to make. Who’s saying that the PowerPC architecture is not good or that a Linux variant (look the word up in a dictionary, Gautham—just because everyone uses the word “distro” doesn’t mean it’s the only appropriate one) for the iPod is not desirable.?
My point was that comments like Apple’s switching from PowerPC being a mistake and Linux being a major selling point (or any selling point at all) for the iPod are just plain stupid. Words are not enough to describe how stupid they are.

But, of course, he had to go off on a passion induced tangent to prove some redundant, completely unrelated point. It’s impossible to have a proper conversation with people like him.

 

[MetalheadGautham]

Just to point something out. Theres a good amount of research showing that theres a noticeable chunk of consumers who base their purchasing decisions just based on brand name.

Now that the topic is going way off course I think I'lll choose to stay off it .

I said "in his right mind"
Even I am aware of this fact that ppl are sometimes ignorant buyers.

 

[aryayush]

Oh, and by the way, branding plays a vital role in the purchase decisions of 90% of all middle class people and 100% of all those above the middle class, and it should. How do you know whether you can trust a particular company’s product or not (in any field, not just in technology)? You look at the brand value and the quality of products you’ve used in the past that carried that branding. That’s just how normal people purchase things. If you don’t, you’re the one who’s doing it wrong—not the other way round.

 

[FilledVoid]

Yeah, well, you could’ve chosen to ignore it. Several months of such diatribes with gx_saurav has made me an expert on that.

Lol my bad there. Anyway if my posts has somehow contributed some kind of OS war here I hope the posters beyond this post stick to the topic rather than deriving unintended meanings from something I posted.

Thanks.

 

[MetalheadGautham]

Yeah, well, you could’ve chosen to ignore it. Several months of such diatribes with gx_saurav has made me an expert on that.

As for that comment, his whole post is completely unrelated to the point I was trying to make. Who’s saying that the PowerPC architecture is not good or that a Linux variant (look the word up in a dictionary, Gautham—just because everyone uses the word “distro” doesn’t mean it’s the only appropriate one) for the iPod is not desirable.?
My point was that comments like Apple’s switching from PowerPC being a mistake and Linux being a major selling point (or any selling point at all) for the iPod are just plain stupid. Words are not enough to describe how stupid they are.

But, of course, he had to go off on a passion induced tangent to prove some redundant, completely unrelated point. It’s impossible to have a proper conversation with people like him.

You mean to say it was because of gx_saurav that I wasted my time trying to remember all I know about IBM POWER while you did not start it ?

Saurav, I shall have my revenge.

Oh, and by the way, branding plays a vital role in the purchase decisions of 90% of all middle class people and 100% of all those above the middle class, and it should. How do you know whether you can trust a particular company’s product or not (in any field, not just in technology)? You look at the brand value and the quality of products you’ve used in the past that carried that branding. That’s just how normal people purchase things. If you don’t, you’re the one who’s doing it wrong—not the other way round.

Relying on brand alone can be disasterous.
I agree brand Equity is an important bonus for the company...
But for customers....
Look at the XFX 8600GT for example.

 

[infra_red_dude]

Well hey! Why have this thread in the first place? No one has any proof of what the OS is actually going to be like. We are all just speculating.

I understand that. What I meant to say is that at least for things which are certain (like the kernel upgrade and stuff), we shouldn't provide wrong info. This only leads to digression and then stuff like.. oh not even a kernel upgrade? And then 10 other useless replies follow. Anyways.. I'm sure the point I'm trying to make is clear.

Dude, you must be seriously out of your mind.

apple moved from ppc to x86. It rocks

Moving to the Intel platform was probably the best decision by Apple as far as the sales are concerned.

3. You think people don't require any flexibility ? You think FLAC support and MPC support is useless ? You think its pointless playing DOOM on iPod ? You think running GBA games on iPod is a waste of time ?

When you want that "flexibility" you don't buy Apple products!!

No person in his right mind will buy a product seeing its brand name.

You are mistaken my boy!

[Offtopic]

A little bit of difficulty in programming is I think worth the power difference.

PPC arch. has always been poorly exploited. The potential it has is immense. But a lot of things improved for Apple when they moved over to Intel. It was more of a business related decision.

PS: I mentioned PPC's power only because Aayush was going about how its "dead" and how nobody uses PPC.

PPC is dead in the computing world! Its existence is negligible. You don't buy Mac OS X to install it on PS3! Get real, dude!

I agree, tho, that ethically it was bad on Apple's part to announce that PPC won't be supported. Its a bit too early!

[/Offtopic]

Wait a sec there: Apple is NOT 64 bit already ?
I thought they moved to 64 bit Intel x86 from IBM PowerPC.

They did when Macs started being shipped with C2Ds. Leopard has multiple kernels.

 

[MetalheadGautham]

I understand that. What I meant to say is that at least for things which are certain (like the kernel upgrade and stuff), we shouldn't provide wrong info. This only leads to digression and then stuff like.. oh not even a kernel upgrade? And then 10 other useless replies follow. Anyways.. I'm sure the point I'm trying to make is clear.


Moving to the Intel platform was probably the best decision by Apple as far as the sales are concerned.


When you want that "flexibility" you don't buy Apple products!!


You are mistaken my boy!

[Offtopic]


PPC arch. has always been poorly exploited. The potential it has is immense. But a lot of things improved for Apple when they moved over to Intel. It was more of a business related decision.


PPC is dead in the computing world! Its existence is negligible. You don't buy Mac OS X to install it on PS3! Get real, dude!

I agree, tho, that ethically it was bad on Apple's part to announce that PPC won't be supported. Its a bit too early!

[/Offtopic]


They did when Macs started being shipped with C2Ds. Leopard has multiple kernels.

Thanks for that.
Cleared some things up and bettered others.

 

[aryayush]

Thank you, because all the things he said were exactly what I was trying to say and pretty much in those exact words. I’m just glad somebody got through to you.

What I meant to say is that at least for things which are certain (like the kernel upgrade and stuff), we shouldn't provide wrong info. This only leads to digression and then stuff like.. oh not even a kernel upgrade? And then 10 other useless replies follow.

Oh, I can certainly identify with that.

Relying on brand alone can be disasterous.

Yes, it absolutely can. I disagreed with you that you shouldn’t look at the brand when buying any product but I did not insinuate that you should just look at it either. All I’m saying is that when you set out to purchase a product, branding plays a crucial role, one among many others (user reviews, for example).

I’ll give you an example: I wanted to buy a Bluetooth headset for myself. Given that I have an iPhone and Apple sells a sexy Bluetooth headset that matches the look of the phone, is tiny and comes with a Dock that charges both the iPhone and itself, I thought I would buy it. So I went to the Apple Online Store and read the reviews left by customers and, to my surprise, pretty much every reviewer hated the headset—static issues, no noise cancellation, poor call quality and lack of durability were some of the issues repeatedly mentioned, on Apple’s own online store no less (full credit to them for being honest and not censoring the negative reviews).

So I up and bailed and decided to buy one from Plantronics instead, one that is slightly more expensive than the Apple version, much less attractive (at least from what I could see in the picture) and, the biggest bummer, does not come with a charging station for both itself and the iPhone.

When I said I’m only an Apple fanboy sometimes, this is the sort of thing I was referring to. Yes, money is hardly a factor for me when making purchase decisions. It’s all about quality and that doesn’t necessarily mean that I will always buy Apple products no matter what.

 

[gxsaurav]

we r back to square 1 that Apple is updating Mac with optimisation & new technologies that Microsoft has already given with Vista.

Apple is simply copying what Vista already gave 2 years back. , they r trying to match Microsoft in OS backend department with new technologies which will break compatibility with existing product & drop support for a high end Mac released only 3 years back, but it's a good thing when Apple does it but bad when MS

Talk about double standards. Apple was mocking Vista that because of it people having old computers have to buy new. Now even only 3 year old Apple hardware needs to be thrown away & replaced with new one. Well, Vista ran fine on a 2004 purchased Pentium 4 PCs but Mac OS X Snow Leopard won't

run on 2004 purchased high end Mac

 

[infra_red_dude]

we r back to square 1 that Apple is updating Mac with optimisation & new technologies that Microsoft has already given with Vista.

Apple is simply copying what Vista already gave 2 years back. , they r trying to match Microsoft in OS backend department with new technologies which will break compatibility with existing product & drop support for a high end Mac released only 3 years back, but it's a good thing when Apple does it but bad when MS

Talk about double standards. Apple was mocking Vista that because of it people having old computers have to buy new. Now even only 3 year old Apple hardware needs to be thrown away & replaced with new one. Well, Vista ran fine on a 2004 purchased Pentium 4 PCs but Mac OS X Snow Leopard won't

run on 2004 purchased high end Mac

Sir, if I read all the posts correctly here this is what you said last time.. and in the post before that.. and before that.. and so on... don't you haf anything new to say?!!!

We know that Apple announced that Snow Leopard won't run on PPC. THAT IS BAD! Point noted.. and I doubt if a single person here would say that its NOT BAD to drop PPC support so early.

Relying on brand alone can be disasterous.

Agree with you 100%. But then its a double edged sword!

 

[mail2and]

I said "in his right mind"
Even I am aware of this fact that ppl are sometimes ignorant buyers.

Interesting to note that you believe that half of the students and faculty at a university that produced 13 nobel laureates including Dr. Amartya Sen, numerous heads of states, CEOs/CFOs of virtually every big corporation on earth, are 'ignorant' buyers.

Don't get me wrong, I have used Linux extensively. But, choosing a Mac over say a HP laptop wouldn't make me exactly ignorant. It's called a person's choice. This choice costed me less than any competing choice. So, please do learn to respect choices.

It'll be a sad day when the chairman of Creative Commons in the UK, a professor at my university, was to be called ignorant; or the world's leading academic on outsourcing to be said not to 'be in his right mind'.

 

[gxsaurav]

@Anirudh

It's not about that, it's about Apple's double standerds. They bashed Vista for breaking compatibility & not running on some old computers but when they r doing the same thing it's all of a sudden justified according to Macboys

 

[aryayush]

Yeah, because what Microsoft did with Vista and what Apple is doing here is totally the same thing. Marketing your OS as being capable of running on low end hardware (while it’s clearly not) and making deals with your hardware vending partners to stick “Works with Vista” logos on computers that run Vista extremely slowly and hardly even have all the requisite drivers is exactly the same as explicitly and transparently dropping support for a platform they moved away from four years ago (after notifying customers a year in advance, if I may add). Yeah, both are the exact same things and poor ol’ Microsoft has to take an unfair bashing for what is essentially a crappy operating system release (after seven freaking years) that doesn’t work. Totally similar cases.

Not to mention the fact that it’s not like PowerPC users are going to miss anything because Snow Leopard isn’t going to bring in any new consumer level features (except support for Microsoft Exchange). Of course, then you might argue that XP users don’t miss anything either by not upgrading to Vista, and I agree with that, so yeah, that point kinda falls apart.

------------------

Also, please note (all of you) that the decision to drop PowerPC hasn’t been finalised yet (though I personally think it has) and, for all we know, it could be supported in the final release of Snow Leopard.

And whatever I’ve said in reply to gx_saurav doesn’t mean that I change my stance on the whole issue—dropping support for PowerPC is indeed too early. They could’ve stalled it to until after 2010.

 

[gxsaurav]

I m so sorry Arya, I forgot U R unable to use Windows at all due to your computing noobness.

Do I have to remind again that somehow I was able to use Windows Vista better then XP on my old P4 Machine with right deployment, I wonder how I did that & wrote a guide to help everyone. Just cos U failed to use Vista doesn't mean it is bad.

Here in my new office all workstations run XP which I updated to SP3. I asked for a new workstation on day 1 & was given a HP Workstation. People were skeptic about it due to Vista FUD but I told them to use Vista on it with personal assurence that it will work fine & right now after optimising properly, it is running better then XP SP3 on same hardware. Now, everyone wants to work on my PC cos it just works better for same work then XP

 

[aryayush]

Uh… just to make it clear, my previous post does not mean that I’ve stopped ignoring your replies. I just had some scathing (and funny) remarks to make and couldn’t bear the thought of letting them die in my head, so I poured them out. Your posts are still as unimportant to me as they’ve been for the past year.

Now, with that out of the way, feel free to dish out whatever crap you want—just don’t expect much in the way of replies. Thank you!

 

[goobimama]

I m so sorry Arya, I forgot U R unable to use Windows at all due to your computing noobness.

Do I have to remind again that somehow I was able to use Windows Vista better then XP on my old P4 Machine with right deployment, I wonder how I did that & wrote a guide to help everyone. Just cos U failed to use Vista doesn't mean it is bad.

Here in my new office all workstations run XP which I updated to SP3. I asked for a new workstation on day 1 & was given a HP Workstation. People were skeptic about it due to Vista FUD but I told them to use Vista on it with personal assurence that it will work fine & right now after optimising properly, it is running better then XP SP3 on same hardware. Now, everyone wants to work on my PC cos it just works better for same work then XP

I wonder, just wonder, why the Core 2 Duo system running Vista is slower than an Intel E2120 running XP... it just boggles the mind.

 

[aryayush]

Haven’t you been paying attention? Because you didn’t do the oh-so-crucial “optimisation”, man. I can suggest at least one optimisation—upgrade to XP (if Windows is the only option, that is).

 

[goobimama]

Optimisation? What's that? I'm just a dumb n00b macboy, you know, those pretty computers with the cool UI....