Grand Strategy Games discussion thread

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heidi2521

Padawan
We can use this thread to discuss grand strategy games like Europa Universalis, Victoria, Crusader Kings etc.

Q: I have never played a strategy game. Where do I start?

A: Hearts of Iron III with the expansions Their Finest Hour, Semper Fi and For The Motherland.

Q: I have only ever played Civilization, Total War and Age of Empires. Where do I start?

A: Europa Universalis III: Chronicles (not Complete. EUIII: Complete is incomplete. It is missing Heir to The Throne and Divine Wind)

dead5's recommended GSGs.


Europa Universalis III

Probably the easiest one out there. You can choose over 200 nations to play from and start anytime from 1399 to 1812. If you've never played a GSG before, definitely the one you should get. As I stated earlier, DO NOT GET COMPLETE. it is incomplete. Get Chronicles instead. It is complete.

Victoria II

More complex than Europa Universalis III with a greater focus on economy and politics. Get this one once you are comfortable with EUIII. The a House Divided expansion improves this game a lot and is a must have. I haven't played Heart of Darkness yet, so no comments.

Crusader Kings II

This unlike the games mentioned above this one focuses more on dynasty building and personal relationships. You choose to play as a feudal lord from medieval europe in this game and try and gather as much prestige for your dynasty as you can. Probably one of the most intriguing titles around with the greatest element of randomness. Plays a lot like A Game of Thrones. diplomatic marriages, backstabbing, reputation, spies, assassination etc. Also a good starting point for beginners.

Hearts of Iron III

Are you sure you are man enough to take the challenge?


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Playing as Castille on easy in Europa Universalis III

*i.imgur.com/fwydyHs.jpg
 
C

chris

In the zone
Will your towns get destroyed after each game session or you can login any time and continue from previously left out ?
 
OP
H

heidi2521

Padawan
^

(;￢_￢)

Why would any game designer do that, especially in games where campaigns can easily last 100 hours?
 
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shivakanth.sujit

Padawan
I have never played gsg before. I would like to. What is the story behind hearts of iron and Europa. How much does each game cost at retail and online? Installation files size?? Can you recommend any good tutorial to kick start ?

Thanks in Advance!

Shiva
 
OP
H

heidi2521

Padawan
Europa Universalis III

Wikipedia said:
Players begin the game by choosing what date they would like to start their campaign and which country they would like to play as. Once in game, players can shape their countries in many different ways. Forms of government include various kingdoms, republics, theocracies, and tribal governments. Players can influence a nation's society and values by adjusting "sliders" such as free trade/mercantilism, and may hire court advisors such as Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart. As the game advances, players can pick "national ideas" such as Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité, which give specialized bonuses.
The game has over 300 playable countries, including giants like Ming China, regional powers like Bohemia and Kazan, and tiny nations like the Maldives. Without formal victory conditions, players sometimes set goals for themselves like raising a minor city-state to world prominence. The world map includes some 1,700 provinces and sea zones. Many provinces in the Americas, Africa, and Oceania are not owned by any country, allowing for colonization.
Economics in the early modern era is simulated by taxes and production income from provinces, as well as trade. National merchants compete in "centers of trade" such as Venice and Lübeck, and nations focused on trading income (e.g., Holland) enjoy significant advantages. Nations which mint too much currency, or are over-reliant on gold mining, are penalized by inflation. Technology investment is important in the long run; the game does not use a Civ-style tech tree, but instead has several different technology categories, which unlock new military units and buildings.
Diplomacy is rather detailed: royal marriages, insults, alliances, trade embargoes, and so on all affect relations between countries. Players are able to gain control over other countries peacefully through personal unions and vassalage. Early international institutions such as the Holy Roman Empire, the Papal Curia and with the Divine Wind expansion the Shogunate are simulated in some depth. Every country has its own culture and religion, a frequent source of diplomatic unity or friction.
Rulers have control over armies, navies, and mercenaries they recruit. Combat is abstract, with no direct control over battles (contrast the Total War games). Military tradition is necessary for recruiting good generals and admirals. Aggression (seizing provinces without a rightful claim) is checked by the "badboy" system of international infamy common to Paradox's games.
The game is historically detailed; one can play the "grand campaign" starting in 1453 or 1399, but any date before the French Revolution (1821 with the Napoleon's Ambition expansion) is a valid starting point as well, with historical leaders and countries appropriately updated. Major events such as the War of the League of Cambrai are playable this way. Often the game diverges from reality after some time in-game, with unhistorical events such as Portugal colonizing North America, or Poland-Lithuania surviving to bully its neighbors.
The game may be played single-player or multiplayer, with players controlling different countries; every non-human country is controlled by its own AI.
Click to expand...

I'd recommend staying away from HOI if you've never played a grand strategy game before.

The main difference between normal strategy games and grand strategy games is that GSGs have a very high level of abstraction when compared to SGs. EG. You control where each of your armies move but not the units in battle themselves, you choose where the buildings are built but not their placement etc. These games have relatively complex simulations when compared to its non grand kin. You spend a lot of time in diplomacy, going through nation statistics, managing your economy etc. compared to most normal strategy games. These games also last a whole lot longer, often stretching above 50 hrs. These games rarely have fixed victory conditions so you choose if and when you have won a game. For somebody subjugating the entire middle east as brittany will be a victory, for someone else world domination.

As for tutorials, there are quite a few youtube videos and the games inbuilt ones but the best thing I can recommend is playing as a fairly stable european nation like Castille or England on one of the easier difficulties until you get a hang of the game mechanics and interface. Also, Google. Use it. You can post specific questions on ParadoxPlaza.com or /r/paradoxplaza. I'm not really that great at these games so I may not be able to help.

CKII Complete is about 600MB to download, EUIII: Chronicles is 700MB.

The games often go on sale in GamersGate, ParadoxPlaza shop and Steam. In fact, right now you have 75% off on EUIII chronicles in GamersGate($7.50 total) and 75% off on CKII in the ParadoxPlaza shop($15 for CKII + SOI + Republic). I'd recommend GamersGate because of their rewards program and because the games are DRM free over there.

You can safely ignore DLC from CK2 not named Sword of Islam or The Republic. They are pretty much useless.
 
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shivakanth.sujit

Padawan
Thanks!! Will check out and reply. Have exam now. :( :( .They will end by this this week, till ten I will be studying. Anyway thanks for the clarifications .

Shiva
 
gameranand

gameranand

Living to Play
Well actually Grand Strategy Games are not good for newbies, first play conventional RPGs and TPSs and then get to these games.
If you have already played many RTS and TPS then there is nothing "good for newbie" because you are not a newbie anymore.
 
OP
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heidi2521

Padawan
Uhh.... XCOM: UFO Defense is not a grand strategy game. And why are you recommending roleplaying games and third person shooters to someone interested in strategy games :lol:

One can be a newbie to gsgs without being a newbie to strategy games. But if a person has never played a strategy game and wants to get into gsgs he should play hoi, get his arse kicked and not come back for quite some time.
 
gameranand

gameranand

Living to Play
Actually I made a mistake I wanted to write TBS not TPS, however I have written RTS for RPG. :D:D

A newbie will find it very difficult to micromanage everything when he don't even have practice at RTS and TBS to manage the major components of the game. :)
 
OP
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heidi2521

Padawan
Yeah. When shivakanth.sujit said

I have never played gsg before
Click to expand...

I'd assumed he had experience in other strategy games like Civilization, Age of Empires, Company of Heroes, Command & Conquer because he chose to single out GSGs. Trying to get into GSGs without any experience in strategy would be like trying to get into competitive Quake 3 Arena without ever having played a shooter.
 
Piyush

Piyush

Lanaya
@OP

I find CIV series a lil slow paced while RoN/AoE are a bit fast paced.
So where do these GSGs stands in terms of game pace?
 
gameranand

gameranand

Living to Play
Piyush said:
@OP

I find CIV series a lil slow paced while RoN/AoE are a bit fast paced.
So where do these GSGs stands in terms of game pace?
Click to expand...

You can say Medium and Fast Pace but you have to manage a hell lot of things. A very small decision will have a big impact.
 
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