New Gaming PC for 30-35k

[sakumar79]

Hi all,
It has been a couple of years since I assembled my first computer which I have at home... It was an Athlon 2800+, ASUS mobo, 512 MB DDR RAM, 80 GB SATA HDD, Combo Drive, ATI Radeon 9600, Zebronics Shivaji Cabinet, Logitech Basic Keyboard and Optical Mouse, SB Live 5.1 soundcard, Creative Inspire 4.1 speakers, Samsung 793s 17" CRT monitor, Microtek 600 VA UPS. It is running WinXP Pro and it is used mostly for gaming and net browsing at home.

For the past few days, my hands started itching and as soon as is financially viable (within 1 month time), I am planning to assemble a new computer and set the current computer for other use... Most parts will be new with the exception of Monitor (purchase a 15" inch and use it for the current comp), UPS, soundcard, and speakers.

My budget is 35k... I am planning to go for AMD X2 based system rather than Intel C2D system because I believe that for the gaming, the gfx card will be more important and having X2 based system will allow me to put more cash into the gfx card... Also, I already have a copy of WinXP Home Edition... Find below my choices and give your comments... Prices are from ITWares and Delta Peripherals

1. Processor: AMD Athlon X2 3800+ for Rs 4100

2. Motherboard: Option 1 is ASUS M2N8-VMX for Rs. 3150 and Option 2 is ASUS M2A VM for Rs. 4000... Considering that I am going for a separate gfx card, do you think M2AVM will be worth it?

3. RAM: 2x1GB Kingston DDR2 667MHz for Rs. 3900. Is this price correct? I am getting confusing price info from various corners...

4. Hard Disk: 160 GB Seagate SATA2 HDD for Rs 2600

5. Optical Drive: Lite-On 20x DVD Writer for Rs 1900

6. Monitor: Samsung 15" CRT for Rs 3800

7. Cabinet and SMPS: Zebronics Antibiotic with 400W SMPS for Rs. 2400... Please send your comments... Also, alternative Cabinet makers with links to their website for browsing through their offerings will be welcome...

8. KB/Mouse: Logitech Basic Spill-proof keyboard and Iball Precise Laser Mouse for Rs 1100... Any personal opinion on the mouse is urgently requested...

9. Graphics Card: GeForce 7600GT or 8600GT, or ATI 1650XT or 2400XT - Brand Undecided... Budget 10k max...

My main doubt is in the gfx card... Should I go for DX10 card or not? I am not thinking of purchasing Vista in the near future... Will there be games that will need DX10 cards and wont work on DX9 cards? How soon will such a scenario occur? If it is another 2 or 3 years, I probably wont want to shell out extra bucks for a DX10 card which otherwise performs on par with a DX9 card... Also, how do the nVidia and ATI cards compare (forget about SLi, etc)... How important are smaller Fab size, higher core/clock speed, number of shaders? I dont have detailed knowledge of these terminology to make educated guess on the best gfx card for my situation...

BTW, the games I play are typically Adventure type and RPGs, but I hate FPSs because I get nauseated playing them...... In Adventure, I love the Prince of Persia series... In RPGs I enjoy Diablo and Dungeon Siege series of games... Dont like the wait-for-turn type of RPGs... Regularly, I download demos of new RPGs for trying out and see if they are worth buying... (I have night-time unlimited browsing from Airtel and thats how I afford large downloads)....

Anyways, thanx for going through all my ramblings and please leave your comments and suggestions...

Thanx in advance
Arun

 

[adithyagenius]

Good config.
Mouse : Try Microsoft Comfort optical 3000 : Its a good 1000 dpi mouse with no skipping problems. Its very very light and all its buttons are configurable and drivers for 64bit xp and vista are available. It has a side button which can be configured for on the fly sensitivity changing or as a gaming toggle or any mouse/keyboard button. It costs less than Rs900 I think.

Graphics Card: If u have played all the games released till end 2004 like F.E.A.R , san andreas , hl2 etc then dont buy ur graphics card now. Buy the mobo with onboard graphics and buy Dx10 card when prices drop and good games are released. STALKER cant run on high settings on 7600GT without stuttering. Same is the case with Gothic 3 (severe) and spiderman 3. Also call of juarez runs at 30 fps on ultra high settings 1024*768 and its performance drops sometimes. Also the Lost Planet : Extreme Condition dx9 demo runs at 23 fps at high settings (snow ) and 19 (cave) at same resolution. Wait for some real dx10 games which are enjoyable to be released and also for the "proper" vista drivers for gfx cards to be released. Since 2004 only strategy games have been released which can be made to run on onboard gfx cards at medium settings.

 

[keith_j_snyder2]

Well go for a E4300(slightly costlier) rather than X3800+
If ur budget is 10K for graphics card the 8600GT fits in ur budget.The Point Of View 8600 GT is for almost 8000-9000/-.Also if u are going for a graphics card i suggest buy a non-onboard display motherboard.
There is no point of buying a Dx9 card nowdays since u have an excellent option & besides this 8600 GT is better than 7600 GT.

 

[sakumar79]

@adithya - The MS mouse looks promising... If it is within 1000, I will definitely consider this... Also, I dont mind setting gfx in games to 800x600 with medium details, so that may be taken into account... Still, I am also waiting for more info regarding ATI vs nVIDIA DX10 cards comparisons before deciding on this...

@Keith - you raise a good point... First, I thought there was no way E4300 could be compared to X2 3800+, but I read this post *www.anandtech.com/printarticle.aspx?i=2903 which tells me that it is comparable to X2 4200+, and that it is highly overclockable... I have never OCed a proccy, but still this looks like a good option to keep in mind... What motherboard will go nicely with the E4300? Since the Graphics card may be a later purchase, I will need onboard gfx...

Arun

 

[Ethan_Hunt]

Alrighty.Looks like you have the exact same budget that I had when I recently bought my new Core 2 Duo rig.I bought the whole Peripherals from itwares.The only difference between you & me is that you loathe FPS games but me like them down to the very core.Anyways, let's get down to business now.

First off the theory of Graphic card being a major component in playing is true but only partially.Now-a-days many games are getting highly CPU dependent as well.You have an excellent card but don't have an equally good CPU to complement it then the frames would take a beating.This usually happens when you switch fo high resolution gaming.Hence a CPU is as important component as is the graphic card when it comes to PC gaming.

Now if you have fixed your mind on AMD based configuration then atleast make sure you go in for a 4400+ or above system.Using 3600+ at stock speeds wont be of much help later on when DX10 gaming would become a main stream.But if you plan to overclock the 3600+(Brisbane core I presume) then that also would depend on how much you can overclock it.

Next,buying a 15 inch CRT monitor would handicap your gaming to a 1024x768 resolution at the max which I believe if you are planning to buy a 8600GT or 7600GT which are capable or running over 1280x1024 or above for some older games is seriousy under using the card's capability.You'll atleast need a 17 inch monitor with 1280x1024 max resolution at 75hz refresh rate or a 19 inch for 1600x1200 resolutions.Mind you the 19 inch CRT models have gone cheap.I paid 8.1k for my Viewsonic Montior.

Go in for Zebronics Lava cabinet & add in an Powersafe 500Watt PSU if you ought to use even a mid-range DX10 card.

As for the the graphic card the difference between 7600GT & 8600GT is a mere 1k I suppose.So it's better to go in for a DX10 solution for now.The clock speeds & memory bandwidth counts a lot since games today use too much of shader details & also require more bandwidth to run on decent resolutions.

I'll try & sum up a good solution by tomorrow as I have to head out for work right now.WIll catch up with you tomorrow.Till then take some advice from rest of the members.

 

[cvvikram]

For a gaming PC, the monitor should be atleast 17' and above for better experiance.

 

[sakumar79]

Hmm... Thanks for all your comments, but somewhere in my rambling first post (see second paragraph), I mentioned that I will use my current 17" monitor for the machine and put the 15" monitor for the old comp... I will check other comments and reply tonight in greater detail...

Thanx again
Arun

Okay, after deeper analysis, I am again going back to AMD... C2D E6320 retails at 8350 whereas X2 4600+ retails at 6250 and appears to be roughly equal performers... How will the X2 4600+ go with ASUS M2A-VM (non-HDMI) motherboard...

BTW, how is the M2A-VM's onboard gfx? It is supposed to have X1250 based graphics... And my current card is Radeon 9600... I am assuming that the X1250 based gfx will be at least on par if not better than my current card. Am I right? If so, I will probably put off the gfx card purchase for a later date...

My budget excluding gfx card should be around 25k...

Arun

 

[adithyagenius]

Onboard gfx cards always suck. My raedon 7500 64mb used to get 8 times more score on 3dmark than 256mb x300 onboard. Never settle for onboard. Buy atleast a cheap gfx card. All onboard cards give less than 350 on 3d mark 06 despite chipset. But cards like 7600GT give 2800+. Even 6600GT gives in 4 digits. Right now , due to PC game drought you can use onboard gfx to play old games but not san andreas or fear. You can play strategy games. but again if you are spending way too much on motherboard for the onboard gfx , you can as well buy a cheap mobo without onboard gfx and buy a very cheap gfx card and extend your w8 time for dx10 price drops and increase framerates on old games.

if [ cost(onboard gfx mobo) - cost(mobo without gfx) ] > cost(cheap gfx card)
then buy cheap mobo + gfx card
else buy mobo with good onboard gfx.

 

[keith_j_snyder2]

See now days most of the "onboard displays" have max. nforce 6150+430.I suggest go for a 6200 DDR2 card rather than onboard.The 6200 performs much better because when u use the external card there is dedicated graphics.The graphics card is the second processor in a computer which holds all the graphics stuff.
Thats what adityagenius wants to say,right?
And i totally agree with him.

 

[sakumar79]

With AMD mobos, onboard gfx is customary and the model I chose (ASUS M2A-VM) costs 4k only... So, for me that is cheaper than getting a cheap external gpu... Currently, the game I am playing is Diablo II.

Arun

 

[morgoth]

In fact I am having same trouble. with a budget of 32K (max) i am trying to get a PC without gfx. I have made two processor+mobo combo:

X2 4600+ Rs 6000
Jetway M2A692-GDG Rs.3600 or Asus M2A-VM Rs.4200
Combo: 10K
VS
E4400 (this latest processor from Intel is better than E6300 in performance and almost equals E6400 in some benchmarks) around Rs 6000
MSI Neo-2 Rs 6000
Combo: 12K (in case of E4300 11.5K)

Advantages with AMD are better features in Mobo, great integrated graphics and very good prices.

Trouble with Intel is a slightly expensive mobo (considering the feature available in Mobos going with AMD processors) and poor integrated graphics. But advantage with Intel are better processor, latest technology (65nm chip, less heat, less power) and option to overclock easily. However, there is one more trouble that negate much of Intel's advantage. E4400 is not simply available in the market (it was launched on 22 April and it is yet to appear in Delhi market. It is supposed to sell at around 6k but due to short supply is selling at RS 7300 at Itwares.)

Btw all these new mobos based on AMD 690G chip are best for onboard graphics. They can run even games such as Far Cry at playable framerates. around 27-28 FPS on lower settings.
*www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2942&p=8

Now tell which combo is better deal?

 

[sakumar79]

Some new doubts:
1. For Intel E6550 (1333 MHz FSB), will a 800MHz FSB Mobo be a bottleneck? Is there a cheaper alternative to XFX 650i? Also, If I go for E4400 instead with 800 MHz FSB, will Asus P5GC-MX mobo (3k) be a good choice?

2. Any reviews for iBall Workhorse cabinet? Any good black based cabinets?

3. Whats the difference b/w Sony DVD Writer Box and OEM (50 Rs) - any chance for Spurious items? How to identify

4. Any previous experience with logitech G1 mouse and/or the iBall precise? Which is a better purchase. iBall available as KB+mouse combo for 11k while the logitech combo is 14.5k

Thanks in advance
Arun

 

[dOm1naTOr]

@sakumar79
Amd prices has fallen very much
X2 5000+ : 4.6k
XFX 8600GT 6.5k
also ATI X2600XT gives 8600GTs level of graphics and is lil cheaper.
----------------
i own the iball laser precise and it is very gud in perfomance. The only downside is the large size. Ull shud have a large palm to use it comfortably. Also if u tweak the polling rate of it to 1000Mhz (1ms) like copperhead, then its really a gamerz mouse.

I dun suggest u to go for G1. Go for MX 518 or the Genius ergo 525. Both are below 2k now.

 

[..:: Free Radical ::..]

^ I would sincerely suggest to wait for October when, E4600 comes out.
The E4300, E4400 would be a lot cheaper then.
I saw E4400 selling for as little as 4900 a couple of days back.
You may get E4300 for 4500.
Its nuts to have a gaming rig and not OC it. The new DX10 card, sigh, what can I say. The 8600 series does not do justice at all. Wait till October. We may have bettercards by then.

 

[sakumar79]

^^^Currently, if given a choice between E4300 and E4400, I would choose E4400... But, I dont want to OC it because I am not a hardcore gamer... Just an avid gamer... When do the ATi DX10 cards hit India?

Arun

 

[Pathik]

even i m goin to take a 35k pc soon and there is a gamer in me too... this is wat i hav decided on..
c2d e6750
xfx 650i ultra
2*1gb ddr2 667
xfx 8600gt
17" crt
250gb sata2 7200.10
creative sbs 370
zebronics antibiotic + 500w psu
sony dru 830a
if it exceeds the budget then i ll get a lower proccy like the 2140 or 2160 cos i m goin to oc it anyway...

 

[dOm1naTOr]

@sakumar79
ATI DX10 cards are already out. The HD X2xxx series are DX10. the X2600XT is available for some 11~12k and perfomance is comparable to 8600GTS.

 

[keith_j_snyder2]

@sakumar79

XFX 8600GT 6.5k
also ATI X2600XT gives 8600GTs level of graphics and is lil cheaper.

So what exactly the price of the 2600 XT which is comparable with 8600 GT?

@sakumar79
The X2600XT is available for some 11~12k and perfomance is comparable to 8600GTS.

I believe this the GDDR 4 version of X2600 XT.

But i m asking about the 2600 XT GDDR3 Version.

 

[wizrulz]

Amd prices has fallen very much
X2 5000+ : 4.6k
XFX 8600GT 6.5k
also ATI X2600XT gives 8600GTS level of graphics and is lil cheaper.

ATI DX10 cards are already out. The HD X2xxx series are DX10. the X2600XT is available for some 11~12k and perfomance is comparable to 8600GTS.

CONFUSING COMMENTS

 

[sakumar79]

^^^The XFX card in first bolded part is a GT model not a GTS model... GTS is a slightly higher end model and is costlier (about 12-13k).

BTW, can someone inform whether in Chennai ATI DX10 cards are available?

Arun