Advice for high end system

[tarey_g]

My friend is building a high end system and needs some advice. He has settled on the following hardware:

Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 (G0 stepping)
4 GB Corsair XMS 2 DDR-800 4-4-4-12 (with EPP), 4x1 GB
XFX 8800 Ultra 650/2200 (PVT80USHE9)

More detail about:
RAM: *www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145034
Card: *www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150236
*www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150236

There are some things that he is having problems with deciding, so I thought posting here for your advice might help out.

He is getting this system at the end of the month (July), when the Intel price drop takes place. When the Q6600 is ordered, is there any way to find out if the processor stepping is really G0 or not? G0 is supposed to be made available from 22nd July, and he is worried that ordering then (as soon as the price drop is reflected in India) will get him an older stepping, as the previous steppings might still be in stock here. So how can he make sure?

EPP (Enhanced Performance Profile) will allow the RAM to run at much tighter timings (better than 4-4-4-12, it is 3-4-3-9 I think). Is there any negative to running with EPP, at enhanced timings? Will it cause overheating?

He has not been able to decide on the motherboard. He is trying to decide between the 680i chipset and the P35 (P35 because of its better memory bandwidth). 680i will support things like EPP, will P35? Please suggest a MoBo for the system mentioned above. MoBo must have SATA RAID (every board has this now, but still…), PCI-E 16x, 4x RAM slots. On-board video will be preferred, for backup, but isn’t a necessity. No need for SLi either. Price range 6k-7k (or any MoBo you expect to fall in this range by the end of the month).

Hasn’t decided on the PSU yet. Looking for a decent 600W min. Price range 3k. The PSU should be able to support the 8800 Ultra. How is the Cooler Master ExtremePower 600W for these requirements? Another thing, the XFX 8800 Ultra doesn’t come with the 2 required molex to 6 pin PCI power converters. Are these available in India? If so, from where? Or will the newer PSU come with these built in?

He hasn’t decided on the cabinet either. Please suggest a decent cabinet, which can comfortably fit the 27 cm (10.5+ inch) 8800 Ultra. Price range 3k-4k. He doesn’t want to spend too much money on a cabinet. It should just look decent, and fit the 8800 Ultra properly (side panel is going to kept open for cooling anyway). He is going to be in Delhi soon, to check out the cabinets, so if you know any seller there who might have a good selection, let me know his contact address.

 

[Pathik]

The zebronics antibiotic shd be spacey enuf.. Also 4 the mobo dont u think u shd increase the price range as its really a high end config..

 

[Stalker]

for the price range of 3k, coolermaster extreme power is the best......but for cards like 8800 ultra , i would recommend antec, corsair....if he can increase his budget for the PSU...
for mobos, i would go with 680i.....but for that price range, how abt 650i
650i has no sli, wheras 680i has.....if he's not gonna use SLI, better go 4 650i. I'll be buying the 650i with q6600 / e6750 with 8800gtx next month / after the price drop....

-off topic-
as far as the geforce 8800ultra is concerned, i feel that the performance is not what i had expected the dx 10 games.........the games are killing these cards at high res/aa/af
----------

&yes, 680i supports EPP
chk here *www.hothardware.com/printarticle.aspx?articleid=965
i dont think the 650i supports EPP though

& like pathiks said, antibiotic is gud enough.

& abt the g0 stepping, even i have the same doubt!

 

[Avatar]

for the price range of 3k, coolermaster extreme power is the best......but for cards like 8800 ultra , i would recommend antec, corsair....if he can increase his budget for the PSU...
for mobos, i would go with 680i.....but for that price range, how abt 650i
650i has no sli, wheras 680i has.....if he's not gonna use SLI, better go 4 650i. I'll be buying the 650i with q6600 / e6750 with 8800gtx next month / after the price drop....

-off topic-
as far as the geforce 8800ultra is concerned, i feel that the performance is not what i had expected the dx 10 games.........the games are killing these cards at high res/aa/af
----------

&yes, 680i supports EPP
chk here *www.hothardware.com/printarticle.aspx?articleid=965
i dont think the 650i supports EPP though

& like pathiks said, antibiotic is gud enough.

& abt the g0 stepping, even i have the same doubt!

Hi, I am the friend tarey_g talked about. Since he is away for some time, I am going to be using his alternate login to post.

I was looking at 650i boards, and found that they are really good! Often leaving behind 680i ones. There are 2 that I found particularly interesting:

ASUS P5N E SLI
XFX 650i Ultra

theitwares.com site puts them at INR 7650 and INR 5550 respectively. The XFX board is really cheap for the amount of power it has. Here is a pretty good review of it: *www.overclock3d.net/reviews.php?/cpu_mainboard/xfx_650i_ultra_socket_775_motherboard/1

The ASUS board is even better (though more expensive by 2k). It's basically the 650i SLI chipset brought up to 680i level. This was made before the 680i LT was released, and since ASUS wanted a cheaper enthusiast level board that removed some of the shortcomings of the 650i chipset, it took the 650i and added all the things that really separate it at 680i with its own implementation of features like LinkBoost and EPP too. This MoBo beats ASUS's own 680i offering in almost all benchmarks. Here is a really good comparison between the two:
*www.techspot.com/review/45-nvidia-nforce-650i-sli-vs-680i-sli/

@Stalker: Which 8800GTX are you buying? What price, and from where?
About the seemingly low performance of these cards under DX 10, AnandTech had a pretty good article about this recently. In conclusion, it mentioned that the performance problems that are being seen right now are most likely due to immature drivers for DX 10/Vista. Since DX 10 is mostly about increasing performance and reducing overhead (thereby allowing developers to add more effects), there should be no reason the games to perform worse than their DX 9 counterparts when there is practically no difference in the no. of effects or IQ. And 2 of the 3 games that allow DX 10 are ports, with DX 10 tacked on.
We will have to wait for true DX 10 titles, like Crysis, BioShock and Alan Wake to see. Intel recently made Crysis available for the public to play at the WSVG in Dallas. The system it was being played on had a Quad Q6700 and 8800GTS (single). Reports say that it was very smooth but froze during explosions. And this was a pre-alpha build. CES had it running at 2560x1600 with a single 8800GTX. That's not bad, considering how jaw-dropping Crysis looks.

I found this document from Intel that gives some details about the G0 stepping. *intel.pcnalert.com/content/eolpcn/PCN107463-00.pdf. There are some dates given, but I have no idea what they mean. The Q6600 should be identifiable by their product code. which will end with 'SLACR'.

BTW, no one answered about the availability of molex to PCIe 6-pin converters in India. Will the Cooler Master 600W have 6-pin power plugs built in?

Also, are you sure about Antibiotic having enough space to accommodate the 8800 Ultra? Can someone who has this cabinet confirm? It doesn't seem so from the photos.

 

[Stalker]

^^O.K
1. about the mobos, i will stick with the 650i.....i wont go for P5N coz i dont want to spend that extra cash over a feature i m never going to use(SLI)

2. xfx 8800 GTX....think its 32 - 33 k.....will ask my dealer to order it from Mumbai

3. abt the dx 10 cards.....r they future proof? coz i feel this is gonna be like geforce FX series(shader model 2)...like it happened with DX 9............after some months the Geforce 6 series(shader model 3) came in...& made the FX cards near obsolete..........................so My question is will the g92 (9xxx) have something like Shader Model 5 or something? or will something like Dx 10a or something come up soon......

 

[spikygv]

i read somewhere that directx11 is expected (by amd)in 18months or 2 years. a bit of bad news , but i dont have any idea about whether or not to trust the source .. plz dont ask for the source coz i forgot to book mark it , i'm sorry.....
but i guess by that time u'll be changing ur pc or atleast the graphics card again , so no need to worry about it..

ps , regarding shaders . shader model 4 is more than enough now. most games run on shader model 2 or at the most 3 .so for 2 years , 8800GTX will serve you more than you want it too.

further , (i dont have a gr8 idea abt this) , but i keep reading that the 8800ultra is highly overpriced and its a much better to buy 8800GTX and OC it...

 

[Avatar]

@Stalker: The P5N E SLI is a 650i board, but with SLI. I don't care about SLI either, but I am impressed with this board's performance. It perfectly matches the ASUS Striker Extreme (read the review linked in my previous post)!

Which PSU have you settled for? And which MoBo?

If you are getting a XFX 8800 card, it will not come with the 2 molex-to-6-pin converters required to run it. How are going to arrange those? Does the PSU you are getting have those?

The current DX 10 cards are future proof as you can possibly get right now. MS is working on DX 10.1 (which will mostly improve AA, along with a few other things). But from what I understand that far off. Even Vista SP1 will not have it (AFAIK). Comparing the 8xxx series to the FX series isn't exactly correct. They can be better compared to the Radeon 9700. Being released far before the competitions entry into a new DX version, totally trouncing everything else out there, the competitor coming very late to the party - but still not being able to perform and taking more power and heat. It looks like ATi's and Nvidia's have reversed positions (when compared to the Radeon 9x and Gefore FX). If the current pattern holds true, 8800 should be viable for quite some time to come (9700/9800 continued to kick ass for quite sometime). Remember, game developers have to make games that will run well on mid-level cards, or they aren't going to see many sales. Upcoming games will have to run well on 8600GTS/2600XT (at decent resolutions - at least 1280x1024) for them to see mass market acceptance. New/better technology is always around the corner, you have to pull the trigger on your purchase at some time, or you will end up waiting forever.

i read somewhere that directx11 is expected (by amd)in 18months or 2 years. a bit of bad news , but i dont have any idea about whether or not to trust the source .. plz dont ask for the source coz i forgot to book mark it , i'm sorry.....
but i guess by that time u'll be changing ur pc or atleast the graphics card again , so no need to worry about it..

ps , regarding shaders . shader model 4 is more than enough now. most games run on shader model 2 or at the most 3 .so for 2 years , 8800GTX will serve you more than you want it too.

further , (i dont have a gr8 idea abt this) , but i keep reading that the 8800ultra is highly overpriced and its a much better to buy 8800GTX and OC it...

The last I read, DX 11 was going to be released along with Blackcomb, so that's at least 2.5-3 years away. If Blackcomb gets delayed (as it most certainly will) DX 11 may be released on Vista first, but still 2.5-years away. MS hasn't even given out DX 10.1's release date yet.

8800 Ultra was waaaay overpriced when released, around USD 300 more. But now the price difference is approx. USD 100 (less than INR 4100). So, that's acceptable to me. Still horribly overpriced in India, but that our country.

 

[spikygv]

^^^ point taken . . just one Q : will our dx10 based cards now be able to support fully dx10.1 ??

 

[Stalker]

@Stalker: The P5N E SLI is a 650i board, but with SLI. I don't care about SLI either, but I am impressed with this board's performance. It perfectly matches the ASUS Striker Extreme (read the review linked in my previous post)!

Which PSU have you settled for? And which MoBo?

If you are getting a XFX 8800 card, it will not come with the 2 molex-to-6-pin converters required to run it. How are going to arrange those? Does the PSU you are getting have those?

well i'm impressed with the p5n e sli's performance...thx for the link....i'll definitely consider this Mobo.....How much will it cost?

abt the PSU...i'm not sure.... i was thinkin about the coolermaster ExtremePower 600W(3k), but i dont know whether it comes with those convertors.....
Corsair HX is very good...but slightly expensive..

btw...from which brand are u buying ur 8800ultra & how much will it cost u?
will there be any price drop in dx10 cards SOON?

 

[janitha]

Yes, the CM Extreme Power 600 has the 6 pin PCIe connector. See the link-
*www.directron.com/rp600pcar.html

 

[Avatar]

well i'm impressed with the p5n e sli's performance...thx for the link....i'll definitely consider this Mobo.....How much will it cost?

abt the PSU...i'm not sure.... i was thinkin about the coolermaster ExtremePower 600W(3k), but i dont know whether it comes with those convertors.....
Corsair HX is very good...but slightly expensive..

btw...from which brand are u buying ur 8800ultra & how much will it cost u?
will there be any price drop in dx10 cards SOON?

theitwares.com puts the P5N E SLI at IRN 7,650/-. Not bad for its performance. I am seriously considering it. I wish they could have removed SLI and made it cheaper though . I don't know how much it will cost in my home town. Probably much higher.

I am getting the XFX 8800 Ultra 650/2.2Ghz. I am getting it from the US, costing USD 650.

 

[Stalker]

& wat abt the PSU.....Cooler Master Extreme Power ? I think it has the best value for money, priced at 3k

& wat abt cooling ?

 

[Avatar]

Yes, the CM Extreme Power 600 has the 6 pin PCIe connector. See the link-
*www.directron.com/rp600pcar.html

Hey, you are right! I should have done my research! CM EP 600W has two 6-pin PCIe power connector, needed for both 8800GTX and 8800 Ultra. Also has: six molex connectors, two 12v rails, two SATA power connectors. Not bad! Not modular, but that's ok.
Can anyone confirm its price? Also mention if that's with or without taxes.

& wat abt the PSU.....Cooler Master Extreme Power ? I think it has the best value for money, priced at 3k

& wat abt cooling ?

Cooling? Depends on the case I get. Most decent cases come with enough cooling fans. I might do what I had done with my older computer, with 6600GT. I had made a rotatable, swiveling arm with a 80mm fan attached. I had attached that to my case pointing at the card from an angle, cooling its RAM chips (RAM wasn't under a heatsink in 6600). Since the 8800 cooler throws the air out of the cabinet, without letting it circulate inside, and the RAM is completely covered up, I will point it at the cards top, where there is no cooling.
The CM 600W has a 120mm fan at the top, so I will have to make sure that the cabinet I get has an opening there.

For more technical details about that PSU: *www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817171013.
Check out the pics too.

BTW, what's the rest of your config? Monitor (which resolution would you be playing at?), HDD, mouse etc.

 

[Avatar]

Hey, can someone please tell me who distributes Cooler Master products in India?