Windows Explorer vs Mac OS X Finder

[gxsaurav]

Apps are not supposed to be copied this way in Windows. That just doesn't work. I wonder what purpose this serves in Mac. Does this means I can open 2 yahoo messengers.

 

[aryayush]

Yes, you can. And it serves a lot of purposes. Playing two chess games simultaneously, downloading two YouTube video from an application that only does one at a time.

You, of course, will always say that something that is there on Mac OS X and not on Windows is useless.

 

[gxsaurav]

Yes, you can. And it serves a lot of purposes. Playing two chess games simultaneously, downloading two YouTube video from an application that only does one at a time.

Hmm, never needed this. Youtube downloaders available for Windows support simultanious download here . By the way, do mean running multiple instances of Yahoo Messnger like this....

*img378.imageshack.us/img378/4227/multipleyahoomessengersf7.jpg

OMG...how did this happened on Windows then?

Arya, Windows can do this easily, it is just limited to application which support it & not Windows/Windows Explorer.

You, of course, will always say that something that is there on Mac OS X and not on Windows is useless.

Hey, who wrote this

More features != better

Lolz

Since you bought Taskbar to the discussion, here is dock annoynence.

1) Dock doesn't groups windows of similar applications. Just take a look at the screenshot below. I have multiple windows of Safari & Finder open but they do not group the usual method. This makes the dock stretch resulting in smaller icons. With multiple windows, this results in a very small dock with icon size as low as 16X16 pixel which makes it very hard to identify things.

*img71.imageshack.us/img71/2159/nogroupingtm9.jpg

2) Dock does not notifies me about how many Windows of a single application I have opened by showing a count. Suppose in this example I have two windows of firefox open. However doesn't has no inidcation method to show me how many windows I have open for firefox. I have myself accidently quit firefox few times thinking that the window I have on my screen is the last firefox window. (Example)

*img487.imageshack.us/img487/1923/picture1qk1.th.jpg

 

[gxsaurav]

tats why arya doesn't minimise them i guess...hehe

Lolz...By the way, I was just looking through what else Leopard copied from Vista's Windows Explorer. Well, guess what, even the new feature of leopard desktop is already there in Vista & with the same name, "Stacks".

Cupertino has started there photocopiers

 

[sakumar79]

@aryayush, Some more points on Explorer -
1. Regarding closing multiple apps simultaneously without opening them - Press Ctrl+Alt+Del to bring up Task manager, under applications tab, you can select multiple apps, and simultaneously minimize, maximize, close, etc.
2. Did you ever search for scripts to enhance your experience while using Windows? I am guessing no... Most people who use Windows are like that. Check out *www.activexperts.com/activmonitor/windowsmanagement/adminscripts/ for some sample scripts that let you automate many tasks... You can google for more resources...
3. Regarding having 2 copies of same application running at once, do you have any specific app in windows that doesnt allow you to run two copies? Because, most of the apps I use allow multiple instances...

I am yet to get your response to my earlier post and am hoping it will be soon (I showed how windows way of drag-and-drop with tree folder is faster than using spring loaded folder, showed how easy it is to create a copy of a file in windows also, and asked about facility to clicklock in mac). In the drag-drop issue, one more issue I would like to raise... How easy is it to drag-drop files from one source folder to different destination folders? Suppose I download some songs, pics, videos... Then, I have folders separately for each and I want to select and transfer files based on type, etc... Now, from explorer, I feel that it will be much easier to do compared to Finder (from what I read) thru spring loaded folders... If it is otherwise, please post steps involved with Finder to elaborate.

Also, you mentioned that you can make just one file in a folder align to grid and keep the rest in disarray. Can you explain why this is useful? Doesnt seem to make sense to me... I typically want to keep all my files in order always...

Arun

 

[aryayush]

@gx_saurav,
The name is the same but there is absolutely no similarity between the features. Both serve completely different purposes and are used in different contexts. Stacks in Vista is a feature of Windows Explorer and Stacks in Leopard is a feature of the Dock.

 

[gxsaurav]

2. Did you ever search for scripts to enhance your experience while using Windows? I am guessing no... Most people who use Windows are like that. Check out *www.activexperts.com/activmon.../adminscripts/ for some sample scripts that let you automate many tasks... You can google for more resources...

Even I did not know about these until few days ago Zeeshan told me how easy it is to do automatc thing using shell scripts. Too bad there is no application in Windows to assist in making such scripts. This is why I said about zeeshan to enlighten us about this.

3) This is actually not a fault of Explorer/ Facility of Finder. In windows this is application dependent. Such as me running two instance of Yahoo messenger as shows above in Windows

Also, you mentioned that you can make just one file in a folder align to grid and keep the rest in disarray. Can you explain why this is useful? Doesnt seem to make sense to me... I typically want to keep all my files in order always...

Arya forgot to mention one thing. you cannot set custom horizontal & vertical spacing or distance between 2 icons in Finder & yet maintain then in a grid. Windows Explorer had this feature since Windows 98

*img486.imageshack.us/img486/617/untitledqb7.jpg

 

[aryayush]

@aryayush, Some more points on Explorer -
1. Regarding closing multiple apps simultaneously without opening them - Press Ctrl+Alt+Del to bring up Task manager, under applications tab, you can select multiple apps, and simultaneously minimize, maximize, close, etc.
2. Did you ever search for scripts to enhance your experience while using Windows? I am guessing no... Most people who use Windows are like that. Check out *www.activexperts.com/activmonitor/windowsmanagement/adminscripts/ for some sample scripts that let you automate many tasks... You can google for more resources...
3. Regarding having 2 copies of same application running at once, do you have any specific app in windows that doesnt allow you to run two copies? Because, most of the apps I use allow multiple instances...

All of these points can be answered with one word 'convenience'. It is convenient on Mac to quit while using 'Command + Tab', it is convenient to use obtain and use AppleScripts and it is convenient to have multiple copies of applications. Windows users generally do not appreciate the value of convenience, Mac users do.

I showed how windows way of drag-and-drop with tree folder is faster than using spring loaded folder

And I showed you how it isn't.

showed how easy it is to create a copy of a file in windows also

I accepted that and corrected it in my original post.

and asked about facility to clicklock in mac

It is there for notebook trackpads but I am not sure about desktops. I am guessing it isn't.

In the drag-drop issue, one more issue I would like to raise... How easy is it to drag-drop files from one source folder to different destination folders? Suppose I download some songs, pics, videos... Then, I have folders separately for each and I want to select and transfer files based on type, etc... Now, from explorer, I feel that it will be much easier to do compared to Finder (from what I read) thru spring loaded folders... If it is otherwise, please post steps involved with Finder to elaborate.

I do not understand why you would find it difficult with drag and drop. I don't. I frequently keep moving stuff from my downloads folder to various folders on my (late) external hard disk and I always use drag and drop. You'll have to use spring loaded folders (with a sense of curiosity and a desire to actually learn a new way of doing things) to appreciate it fully.

Also, you mentioned that you can make just one file in a folder align to grid and keep the rest in disarray. Can you explain why this is useful? Doesnt seem to make sense to me... I typically want to keep all my files in order always...

Then you can do that on a Mac. But I, for one, like to just drag stuff to my desktop every now and then for temporary use and I don't want them to align with the permanent items on the right. However, sometimes I decide that I'll be needing one of those files for a long time, so I just align it on the right. It is useful for me and it is not a bad feature to have.
I can show you a direct comparison. Vista has 256x256 icons and IMHO, they are practically useless. At least I would never use it. But still, it is not a bad feature to have so I listed it among the Finder's drawbacks, even though I do not actually consider it to be one.

 

[gxsaurav]

All of these points can be answered with one word 'convenience'. It is convenient on Mac to quit while using 'Command + Tab', it is convenient to use obtain and use AppleScripts and it is convenient to have multiple copies of applications. Windows users generally do not appreciate the value of convenience, Mac users do.

Not quite.

We can close an application by alt+F4 while switching to it. Wonder how is that hard.

I guess you forgot to read what shell script is, right?

Multiple copy of application like arun said depends on the application. I can run here multiple copies of both 3Ds Max & Maya, same with Winamp.

And I showed you how it isn't.

So far, you haven't shown anything. They both do the same work, just that you do not want to learn something.

I can show you a direct comparison. Vista has 256x256 icons and IMHO, they are practically useless.

The maximum icon size in Tiger running on a 20" display with resolution of 1600X1200 is 128X128.

The maximum size of Vista Icons on a 20" or 24" display with resolution of 1600X1200 or beyond that is 256X256 with font size up to 72 pixel.

I don't think you even know how easy it is to look in explorer of Vista when running on a 20" LCD monitor with a resolution of 1600X1200. The big icons with big text does comes in handy.

 

[aryayush]

The maximum icon size in Tiger running on a 20" display with resolution of 1600X1200 is 128X128.

The maximum size of Vista Icons on a 20" or 24" display with resolution of 1600X1200 or beyond that is 256X256 with font size up to 72 pixel.

I don't think you even know how easy it is to look in explorer of Vista when running on a 20" LCD monitor with a resolution of 1600X1200. The big icons with big text does comes in handy.

I have a monitor with a 1680x1050 resolution. You don't. So I think I am in a better position to comment on this one.

I accept that most icons in Windows Vista look simply fabulous and they look beautiful when viewed at 256x256. When I had freshly installed Vista, I pimped the size to the largest in Explorer for a few days. But after that, I brought it to saner levels again. It is just not possible to work with icons the size of your palms. It is very distracting and it gets in your way. You do not want your icons to be that huge.

 

[gxsaurav]

I have a monitor with a 1680x1050 resolution. You don't. So I think I am in a better position to comment on this one.

Are you trying ot say "I am the only one among us who has used a higher resolution screen" lolz...talk about ignorance.

I accept that most icons in Windows Vista look simply fabulous and they look beautiful when viewed at 256x256. When I had freshly installed Vista, I pimped the size to the largest in Explorer for a few days. But after that, I brought it to saner levels again. It is just not possible to work with icons the size of your palms. It is very distracting and it gets in your way. You do not want your icons to be that huge.

Palm size? Then I wonder why is apple Implementing 512X512 pixel icons in Leopard after Vista already implemented them.

I hope you have used the latest developer build of Leopard

 

[aryayush]

No, I haven't. It is only available to developers (at least legally).

Like I said, it is a completely useless feature for me, but it is not a problem if the feature is there. Apple needs to offer it for the sake of competition. Tiger had larger icons than XP, so Microsoft made them larger in Vista. Now Vista has larger icons, so Apple has to increase the resolution of their icons too otherwise consumers will hold that against the operating system.

 

[gxsaurav]

Like I said, it is a completely useless feature for me, but it is not a problem if the feature is there. Apple needs to offer it for the sake of competition. Tiger had larger icons than XP, so Microsoft made them larger in Vista. Now Vista has larger icons, so Apple has to increase the resolution of their icons too otherwise consumers will hold that against the operating system.

Lolz...so just cos icons are big in competition, leopard is supporting it.

Umm...not compleately true. Windows XP has icons size possible upto 128X128, however the inbuilt Icons in Windows XP were 48X48 max. Third party softwares such as Icon packager bought this functionality to front.

From your Old thread I came to see this line written everywhere

Though it is not as advanced as in Mac OS X

How come? Does Mac OS X makes bread Toast in HD . They both do the same thing.

 

[goobimama]

But those icons hardly had any colour depth.... OS X's icons were whatever-bit from when it first shipped...

You can lick the icons off the screen
- something along that line was said by Mr. Jobs.

 

[aryayush]

He said that about the buttons, not the icons.

 

[goobimama]

Hmm... thought it was the icons.

ah. Just checked it. It is buttons. My mistake

 

[sakumar79]

@aryayush, you did not tell me why spring loaded folders is faster. Read this thread carefully, and you will notice that in one of the later posts, I have explained in detail steps involved in windows and mac and why I believe the windows way is faster. Anyway, for your convenience, I will put it here again

----
Windows (from what I do): 1. Open Explorer. 2. Navigate to destination folder in tree on the left side (Click the + sign to browse subfolders instantly). 3. Navigate to source in main window. 4. Drag files from source and drop on subfolder.

Mac (from what you seem to say): 1. Open Finder. 2. Navigate to source. 3. Drag file, use spring-loaded folder concept to navigate to destination, using spacebar to instantly springload desired folder.

Both should take about same time, but pressing spacebar to instantly springload for each folder is a bit more cumbersome than navigating to destination folder using + sign (the former requires mouse+keyboard action, wheras the latter can be done with either mouse only, keyboard only, or mouse+keyboard)
----

Now tell me where I am going wrong...

Secondly, you said convenience is the reason and I dont get it. I said you can do the same in windows (use scripts, run 2 copies of any app, close multiple apps very quickly) and you say mac is convenient. Please elaborate...

Thirdly, in windows, you can turn off auto arrange and use align to grid. I hope you are aware of that... I use it regularly. For example, you can keep your system shortcuts in one group on the top left corner of the desktop, your browsing apps in another group at the top right corner, office apps at bottom left corner and games in bottom right corner. All these will be aligned to grid. Is this what you are trying to say is missing, or did I misunderstand you?

Please explain to me the steps involved in moving many files from one source folder (say, your basic download folder) into various folders (music, wallpapers, videos, etc). I did not say that it will be difficult, but I felt that it will be easier with windows than with mac... I know how I do it in windows... So, I am requesting you to elaborate how it is done with mac so that I can judge which will be better with me...

Unfortunately, I am from a small town called Madurai and I have to travel to Chennai (about 10 hours) if I have to get access to a Mac, unless I purchase one myself... My brother has an old Mac laptop, but he is in the US and I speak to him once a week only...

Arun

 

[aryayush]

Look, I have been severely mistaken before but I think you really are inquisitive about how a Mac works. If you are seriously interested, I'm going to solve all your doubts. My only request is, please do not pull another gx_saurav on me!

I'll reply to your last post later today. I've got to go somewhere right now.

 

[iMav]

dont pull another gx .... ur afraid tht this guy will also pwn u tooth and nail

 

[aryayush]

Oh yes, I am shivering in my pants.