End users are not supposed to be the beneficiaries of GST input credit from e-commerce sites like Amazon.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
Regarding GSTIN & Amazon invoice
- Thread starter whitestar_999
- Start date
billubakra
Conversation Architect
Why is that? What if the end user is a business concern?End users are not supposed to be the beneficiaries of GST input credit from e-commerce sites like Amazon.
OP
^^Because that is against the Indian laws regarding FDI in retail.That is why Walmart can sale to wholesale dealers in their cash & carry wholesale outlets but they are not allowed to sale to regular persons or open their shops to sale to regular persons online or offline.As for how they identify wholesale dealers from regular users,that is established by their VAT/GSTIN etc quoted by them while placing order & the quantity would be much larger than your typical home user(that is why amazon/flipkart/snapdeal restricts costly item quantities like mobile etc to 1 per account).
billubakra
Conversation Architect
Are we consumers or customers in the eyes of Amazon? They don't have much of the items listed on their Amazon business website so does that mean for a business concern which wants their gst number to be included on the invoice, offline purchase is the only solution?^^Because that is against the Indian laws regarding FDI in retail.That is why Walmart can sale to wholesale dealers in their cash & carry wholesale outlets but they are not allowed to sale to regular persons or open their shops to sale to regular persons online or offline.As for how they identify wholesale dealers from regular users,that is established by their VAT/GSTIN etc quoted by them while placing order & the quantity would be much larger than your typical home user(that is why amazon/flipkart/snapdeal restricts costly item quantities like mobile etc to 1 per account).
OP
There is no legal difference between customer or consumer,Amazon as of now is simply a platform for sellers including its own cloudtail.I am guessing Cloudtail is registered in India as an Indian company selling goods to home users not as a business company selling to wholesale dealers.For wholesale dealers they have to buy directly from distributors of products who will then quote their GSTIN in invoice & most distributors don't sale online.e.g.You can get registered under GSTIN,buy intel processors offline from Intel distributors in Delhi with invoice having your GSTIN & start selling them on Amazon while quoting your GSTIN to amazon to start getting any input tax credit from amazon.
billubakra
Conversation Architect
There is no legal difference between customer or consumer,Amazon as of now is simply a platform for sellers including its own cloudtail.I am guessing Cloudtail is registered in India as an Indian company selling goods to home users not as a business company selling to wholesale dealers.For wholesale dealers they have to buy directly from distributors of products who will then quote their GSTIN in invoice & most distributors don't sale online.e.g.You can get registered under GSTIN,buy intel processors offline from Intel distributors in Delhi with invoice having your GSTIN & start selling them on Amazon while quoting your GSTIN to amazon to start getting any input tax credit from amazon.
There is difference between customer and consumer. You can buy a headphone for me from say a shop so you are a customer and I am a consumer. I really need one so get the hint ha ha
Cloudtail is Amazon's subsidiary with few Indian companies having their shares in it. The seller don't matter. All sellers on Amazon.in are Indian people/companies only. Forget about this because as per the GST act a buyer has the right to get his or her GSTIN number mentioned on the invoice. I am still not able to find the reason behind their excuse as I have been very busy. If you have time then can you mark a mail to them and ask a reason for this? I hope they provide a solid reason for this.
OP
Forget about this because as per the GST act a buyer has the right to get his or her GSTIN number mentioned on the invoice.
GST I GST Invoice Details I Essential Information
Information Required in a GST Invoice
1.Name,Address & GSTIN of the supplier.
.....
.....
4. If the buyer (recipient) is registered then the name, address and GSTIN of the recipient
5. If the recipient is not registered AND the value is more than Rs. 50,000 then the invoice should carry:
i. name and address of the recipient,
ii. address of delivery,
iii. state name and state code
GSTIN is not PAN,not just anybody can get it without having legitimate business credentials.
How to apply for GSTIN by new applicant?
The following documents are required to be uploaded to register under GST Act to get GSTIN.
1. Proof for constitution of business
If the firm applied for GSTIN is a partnership company, copy of partnership deed
In case of businesses like society, Trust etc. which are not captured in Permanent Account Number (PAN), Registration Certificate of such firm is required to be scanned.
So in summary even if you purchase a Rs.1 Lakh laptop from Amazon even then the invoice will contain only Amazon's GSTIN number & not yours because @billubakra purchasing Rs.1 lakh laptop from amazon is not a business entity but a regular customer.
billubakra
Conversation Architect
The place where I work orders office related stuff from online sources especially Amazon due to discounts. The name of their Amazon account is the firm's registered name and it has a GSTIN number. Amazon did not mention the GSTIN number on the invoice and told us to register under Amazon business. Amazon business has very few products with less discounts. Someone told me they are avoiding mentioning customers name on the invoice as they do not think of us as customers and that was my original question.
GST I GST Invoice Details I Essential Information
GSTIN is not PAN,not just anybody can get it without having legitimate business credentials.
How to apply for GSTIN by new applicant?
So in summary even if you purchase a Rs.1 Lakh laptop from Amazon even then the invoice will contain only Amazon's GSTIN number & not yours because @billubakra purchasing Rs.1 lakh laptop from amazon is not a business entity but a regular customer.
OP
They are right.Because your firm has registered GSTIN,your firm is not supposed to place an order on the same platform as regular users.That is why amazon asked you to register under amazon business because if they place the order for your firm registered under GSTIN on same platform as their regular users then it would create problem for them when their tax/GST return is audited by tax department.It is the same reason why there is no single tax return form for everybody,regular users & wholesale/business users are not supposed to buy from same platform just like they are not supposed to file their tax return using same form.
billubakra
Conversation Architect
They are right.Because your firm has registered GSTIN,your firm is not supposed to place an order on the same platform as regular users.That is why amazon asked you to register under amazon business because if they place the order for your firm registered under GSTIN on same platform as their regular users then it would create problem for them when their tax/GST return is audited by tax department.It is the same reason why there is no single tax return form for everybody,regular users & wholesale/business users are not supposed to buy from same platform just like they are not supposed to file their tax return using same form.
I still don't get it. Forget about GST for a second. Amazon is selling stuff to you and me (not Amazon business customers), what are we for Amazon? I just want to understand the same from accounting point of view. Some finance guy was telling me that Amazon acts as an agent or something like that. I am not getting time to ask him about the same again.
P.S. Like I mentioned before almost 90% of the stuff needed by a business concern is not available on Amazon business.
OP
It is not amazon that is selling stuff to you,it is a middleman(like said by your finance guy) & therefore has no direct legal customer relationship with you.Amazon collects commission from sellers for using their platform(aka their website) & I am guessing when you pay for any order,amazon collects that money,deduct their commission & then transfers the balance amount to seller's account.If there is any dispute regarding transaction then it is amazon who will refund any money but then it will deduct same amount from any money lying in seller's amazon account.
As mentioned above,amazon is not a seller & similarly amazon business is also not a seller.It is a platform for sellers who want to sell to business/wholesale/non-regular customers.As there are not much of these sellers hence the low availability of stuff on amazon business.
As mentioned above,amazon is not a seller & similarly amazon business is also not a seller.It is a platform for sellers who want to sell to business/wholesale/non-regular customers.As there are not much of these sellers hence the low availability of stuff on amazon business.
billubakra
Conversation Architect
I order from Amazon.in say from whitestar enterprises and cloudtail I won't get any bill with GSTIN number fine. If I order from Amazon business from the same sellers then who will provide the bill with the GSTIN number the sellers or the company itself? If its the latter then why can't they provide in case of orders from their simple .in website?It is not amazon that is selling stuff to you,it is a middleman(like said by your finance guy) & therefore has no direct legal customer relationship with you.Amazon collects commission from sellers for using their platform(aka their website) & I am guessing when you pay for any order,amazon collects that money,deduct their commission & then transfers the balance amount to seller's account.If there is any dispute regarding transaction then it is amazon who will refund any money but then it will deduct same amount from any money lying in seller's amazon account.
As mentioned above,amazon is not a seller & similarly amazon business is also not a seller.It is a platform for sellers who want to sell to business/wholesale/non-regular customers.As there are not much of these sellers hence the low availability of stuff on amazon business.
OP
It may be only Amazon's GSTIN number or it may be both Amazon's as well as seller's GSTIN number along with your GSTIN number on invoice for purchase from amazon business website.Reason being that when amazon & the seller file their GST returns & claim any input credit they will have the receipt from Amazon business as proof.They can't do this for regular customers(as they don't/can't have GSTIN) or .in website because then the revenues/income invoices from .in website will be a mixture of regular customers having no GSTIN & business customers having GSTIN.
I think you are confusing this too much.Just understand one simple thing.Mixing of retail & business customers is not allowed,be it selling/invoice/market place/platform.Amazon.in is for regular/retail customers & amazon business is for business customers.Buyer's GSTIN can only exist if buyer is a business customer.Billubakra enterprise can have a GSTIN but person billubakra can't.If billubakra want to buy a printer for personal use he will buy it under his own name without GSTIN from amazon.in but if billubakra want to buy a printer for billubakra enterprise then he will buy it under Billubakra Enterprise name mentioning its GSTIN from amazon business to avail any input credit.Also billubakra can't place an order for 10 printers under his personal name from amazon.in site because a regular customer will not buy 10 printers in a single go(hence the limits on quantity of various items on all e-commerce sites for regular users).For placing an order for 10 printers billubakra has to place order under name of billubakra enterprises mentioning its GSTIN from amazon business site.
I think you are confusing this too much.Just understand one simple thing.Mixing of retail & business customers is not allowed,be it selling/invoice/market place/platform.Amazon.in is for regular/retail customers & amazon business is for business customers.Buyer's GSTIN can only exist if buyer is a business customer.Billubakra enterprise can have a GSTIN but person billubakra can't.If billubakra want to buy a printer for personal use he will buy it under his own name without GSTIN from amazon.in but if billubakra want to buy a printer for billubakra enterprise then he will buy it under Billubakra Enterprise name mentioning its GSTIN from amazon business to avail any input credit.Also billubakra can't place an order for 10 printers under his personal name from amazon.in site because a regular customer will not buy 10 printers in a single go(hence the limits on quantity of various items on all e-commerce sites for regular users).For placing an order for 10 printers billubakra has to place order under name of billubakra enterprises mentioning its GSTIN from amazon business site.
billubakra
Conversation Architect
About second paragraph if it is a proprietorship concern then the orders can be in the name of the firm or the proprietor i.e. whitestar technologies or simply whitestar. Anyways I will try to get a hold of that accounts guy and ask him the same. If you ask Amazon all these finance related questions then they are like we have taken your feedback he heIt may be only Amazon's GSTIN number or it may be both Amazon's as well as seller's GSTIN number along with your GSTIN number on invoice for purchase from amazon business website.Reason being that when amazon & the seller file their GST returns & claim any input credit they will have the receipt from Amazon business as proof.They can't do this for regular customers(as they don't/can't have GSTIN) or .in website because then the revenues/income invoices from .in website will be a mixture of regular customers having no GSTIN & business customers having GSTIN.
I think you are confusing this too much.Just understand one simple thing.Mixing of retail & business customers is not allowed,be it selling/invoice/market place/platform.Amazon.in is for regular/retail customers & amazon business is for business customers.Buyer's GSTIN can only exist if buyer is a business customer.Billubakra enterprise can have a GSTIN but person billubakra can't.If billubakra want to buy a printer for personal use he will buy it under his own name without GSTIN from amazon.in but if billubakra want to buy a printer for billubakra enterprise then he will buy it under Billubakra Enterprise name mentioning its GSTIN from amazon business to avail any input credit.Also billubakra can't place an order for 10 printers under his personal name from amazon.in site because a regular customer will not buy 10 printers in a single go(hence the limits on quantity of various items on all e-commerce sites for regular users).For placing an order for 10 printers billubakra has to place order under name of billubakra enterprises mentioning its GSTIN from amazon business site.