India has exam system, not education system

[gopi_vbboy]

i heard from many that they dont teach well in college and i have prepared myself so that i can atleast learn things on my own if i get C.Sc!!

If you have interest you a learn on own...teaching depends on college you join...iit do have good faculty...but 2nd and 3rd tier colleges faculty are not so good..unless lucky

 

[gagan007]

CS Engineering is shite, and you learn absolutely nought by the "courseware". Speaking from erm ...Experience.

Some of my favorite subjects in college were:

Digital Circuit & System
Data Structures
Object Oriented Technology
Analysis & Design of Algorithm
Analog & Digital Communication

I absolutely loved them. If this is BS then what should be best in your opinion. AFAIK, similar subjects are taught in IITs too. Maybe they are also places where knowledge is dumped into minds of some of brightest students in your opinion. I tried to clear IIT-JEE two times, but failed. I know what level of understanding of physics and maths do they require. Frankly, I was not upto it. That does not make the system useless (my brother, also studied in Kendriya Vidyalaya, cracked JEE and finished his B.Tech.)

Some of the above posts said that aptitude should be the criteria to get entrance in premier institutes. But what will you do with apti if you do not know the basics of subjects?

Please do not think this is an aggression, but if you are saying something, please provide proper explanation as what makes you think that way. If I am not able to land on a job which implements above mentioned subjects, is it college/education system fault?

May I know what are your achievements in life? If you do not want to share, it is completely ok. But because you are making tall claims and bashing education system, seems like you are a big shot intellectual.

I admit that there is scarcity of research opportunities in India but saying what is being taught is sh|t, is completely wrong.

 

[Piyush]

The main problem is that everyone wants to get fame, everyone wants to get popular. And for engineers, it is easy if you get admission in any of IITs or NITs. All think that when they will get into these institutions they will be very popular in their locality and hence will easily be able to get a girl friend also will get good placement. Even parents think so. If this would change then everything will change.

i get your point but that was not required

The main problem is the thinking of today.

It's like if you don't have a proper degree you are worthless/useless.

exactly
no one cares about natural talents

Some of the above posts said that aptitude should be the criteria to get entrance in premier institutes. But what will you do with apti if you do not know the basics of subjects?

yes i agree with that
but there should be balance between the two
i mean apt questions should be introduced in the cet exams too in such a way that a balance exist there
this will help to lighten up the burden from students and will increase the scope of critical thinking

 

[nims11]

Some of the above posts said that aptitude should be the criteria to get entrance in premier institutes. But what will you do with apti if you do not know the basics of subjects?

u misunderstood.there is a thing called cut-off in IIT-JEE. that should be the criteria to select students and branches should be allotted to them on basis of aptitude.

Please do not think this is an aggression, but if you are saying something, please provide proper explanation as what makes you think that way. If I am not able to land on a job which implements above mentioned subjects, is it college/education system fault?

no its not, its your fault..

May I know what are your achievements in life? If you do not want to share, it is completely ok. But because you are making tall claims and bashing education system, seems like you are a big shot intellectual.

no i am still a student who is preparing for these entrance exams. and i just presenting my feeling about the education system. precisely, the selection system.

I admit that there is scarcity of research opportunities in India but saying what is being taught is sh|t, is completely wrong.

i didnt say that. as far as school education is concerned, i am happy with it and i think school education(in good schools) in india is better than many good countries.

 

[gopi_vbboy]

Some of my favorite subjects in college were:

Digital Circuit & System
Data Structures
Object Oriented Technology
Analysis & Design of Algorithm
Analog & Digital Communication

I absolutely loved them. If this is BS then what should be best in your opinion. AFAIK, similar subjects are taught in IITs too. Maybe they are also places where knowledge is dumped into minds of some of brightest students in your opinion. I tried to clear IIT-JEE two times, but failed. I know what level of understanding of physics and maths do they require. Frankly, I was not upto it. That does not make the system useless (my brother, also studied in Kendriya Vidyalaya, cracked JEE and finished his B.Tech.)

Some of the above posts said that aptitude should be the criteria to get entrance in premier institutes. But what will you do with apti if you do not know the basics of subjects?

Please do not think this is an aggression, but if you are saying something, please provide proper explanation as what makes you think that way. If I am not able to land on a job which implements above mentioned subjects, is it college/education system fault?

May I know what are your achievements in life? If you do not want to share, it is completely ok. But because you are making tall claims and bashing education system, seems like you are a big shot intellectual.

I admit that there is scarcity of research opportunities in India but saying what is being taught is sh|t, is completely wrong.

Agree ...if we have interest in course we take....it will be easy...i think he was pointing about syllabus being outdated

 

[The Conqueror]

Surfing net, logging into face books

I was shocked to note poor grammar : *www.iitk.ac.in/esc101/current/Lectures/lect1.pdf
FACE BOOKS ?

ESC101N: Fundamentals of Computing For those interested see lecture notes of the highly acclaimed IITK.
Is this what we deserve after working so hard studying irrelevant subjects to get in such institute?

 

[Liverpool_fan]

Some of my favorite subjects in college were:

Digital Circuit & System
Data Structures
Object Oriented Technology
Analysis & Design of Algorithm
Analog & Digital Communication

I absolutely loved them. If this is BS then what should be best in your opinion. AFAIK, similar subjects are taught in IITs too. Maybe they are also places where knowledge is dumped into minds of some of brightest students in your opinion. I tried to clear IIT-JEE two times, but failed. I know what level of understanding of physics and maths do they require. Frankly, I was not upto it. That does not make the system useless (my brother, also studied in Kendriya Vidyalaya, cracked JEE and finished his B.Tech.)

Some of the above posts said that aptitude should be the criteria to get entrance in premier institutes. But what will you do with apti if you do not know the basics of subjects?

Please do not think this is an aggression, but if you are saying something, please provide proper explanation as what makes you think that way. If I am not able to land on a job which implements above mentioned subjects, is it college/education system fault?

May I know what are your achievements in life? If you do not want to share, it is completely ok. But because you are making tall claims and bashing education system, seems like you are a big shot intellectual.

I admit that there is scarcity of research opportunities in India but saying what is being taught is sh|t, is completely wrong.

Let me see what is wrong, never minded Digital Electronics based subjects, but they were not of an interest to me so won't talk of them, but I'll talk of the topics and subjects which were supposed to interest me. Regarding these subjects (DE and communication based), I only felt too much was fed in just a short semester, and sadly most of it was forgotten.

Let's start with programming. Hmm so how should programming be taught? Just put 100 pages of theory of this that and there and absolutely no proper instructions on actual programming, just 1-2 lab classes that's it?

Programming C? Using antiquated compilers like Turbo C++? void main()? gets()? conio.h? Some random questions on prinf("%d%d%d", a++, a--, ++a);? Mixing half the concepts of C and C++? While shift the entire focus was on some bleh generation computing or some blah someone said this and that. Books like Lets us C by Kanetkar sum up C programming education in India.Excellent education, eh?

Data Structures? Let me see. Just some theory with no concrete implementation? Still using those fail methods above? With no actual focus in understanding. Absolutely no intent on learning the implementation. But who cares as long as you can write the same written in book in your answer sheet.

Object Oriented Programming? Again the same as C subject, confusing concepts of C and C++. Fail and outdated programming approaches, "iostream.h", no actual insights on projects on analysis of real world cases. Just rote the definitions, random examples and vormit.

Analysis and Design of Analysis? Yup just rote the algorithms line by line and vormit in the exams. No one cares if you learn what's their actual use and understand their implemention.

Other theoretical subjects like Finite Automata and Discrete Mathematics, quite "easy" subjects to master in some damn 4 months isn't it with like 4 other subjects, assignments, etc. hanging over the student. Oh wait it's again just rote and vormit, no one gives a bloody damn.

I can repeat the same for Internet Technology based subject, outdated markup, and just again rote TCP/IP, etc. and vormit, put in some random bits for socket programming without even basics of C being clear. Who cares if students can't actually understand what is DOCTYPE, just rote that doctype line it will do.

Operating Systems, just rote those random topics all over again.

Database Management System. Well not so bad. Actually enjoyed it. Still would have preferred more practical approach there.

Intelligent Systems, Neural Networks; frankly have little clue what they are about. Will probably have to ride through them when they come. I know it will be rote and vormit all over again.

Microprocessors? Just learn the pin diagrams and so called architecture diagram and vormit.

Networking? Well you are free to be clueless to be able to connect to system or heck describe what a switch looks like, and free to have no idea of sockets (aside from definition), but you are fine if you can just make the OSI model or TCP model.


Practicals? Yup just make a practical file and get it CHECKED. Whether you did or anything or more importantly learnt, is matter of no concern.
Projects? Most are copy paste from the interwebs. Just copy paste and put it into a beautiful spiral bound, that is what desired here.

And I forgot to mention how the first year, a very vital year to build foundations is wasted in the excuse of common subjects.
------------

As for getting admission in colleges, it should be based on aptitude plus knowledge on that branch, well IMO at least.

As for achievements in life, well I'm a pre-final year, and cosidering the college I got to, etc., I'll say it will lie in negative at this point of time.
Well, I hope I will eventually achieve.

As for bashing our education system, I will. Considering the amount of graduates passing out of colleges, heck even IITs and NITs, how many innovations have actually happened there. How many papers and projects come from Indian colleges? Heck the innovation coming from cream of our colleges can't touch the knees in other Asian education systems.

All right I am speaking in perspective, from average "local" colleges of me and people I know, but I have had a look at NSIT's bits too wasn't that so much better. Have one look who uses "Turbo C++" in the world, answer will be clear. And those comments on the programming posts of Indian students.

And I don't claim to be big shot or anything just somewhat frustrated, and frankly tired of this "Indian education rocks" bullshit. Or our delusion of being better of Americans/Chinese/Europeans, etc.

 

[gopi_vbboy]

I was shocked to note poor grammar : *www.iitk.ac.in/esc101/current/Lectures/lect1.pdf
FACE BOOKS ?

ESC101N: Fundamentals of Computing For those interested see lecture notes of the highly acclaimed IITK.
Is this what we deserve after working so hard studying irrelevant subjects to get in such institute?

mobile phone ofense

 

[The Conqueror]

mobile phone ofense

Really? Is that engineering? Exams asking to create a simple a+b program?

 

[nims11]

we had a question in C.Sc board exam this year - "What is web 2.0?"
you will be surprised that all my class mates except 1(+me) were not able to answer this question, just because it isnt given in sumita arora. after the exam, the topper of my class said me that he wrote -"it is a web browser"!!

As for getting admission in colleges, it should be based on aptitude plus knowledge on that branch, well IMO at least.

+1
that's what i am trying to express...

 

[gagan007]

@nims11: None of my comments in above posts were for you mate, except the aptitude part

 

[Faun]

^^lol...i had my share of moments too in biology

 

[axes2t2]

we had a question in C.Sc board exam this year - "What is web 2.0?"
you will be surprised that all my class mates except 1(+me) were not able to answer this question, just because it isnt given in sumita arora. after the exam, the topper of my class said me that he wrote -"it is a web browser"!!

This should go in this thread
*www.thinkdigit.com/forum/community-discussions/108939-dumbest-things-youve-heard-related-computers-44.html

 

[ico]

*i.imgur.com/qVX0H.jpg

 

[geek2091]

The System has to be totally changed.Not just engineering or any coll degree,the system has be reviewed right from 1st grade.children should be made to enjoy what they are learning.Creativity & hunger for knowledge has to be given a upper hand and not merely the marks scored.
For all this to happen the outlook of the society should gradually improve.Its sad that even now people have this notion "Marks-directly proportional-Intelligence"
Seriously most of the exams we write are nothing but just a memory test

 

[abhijangda]

Let's start with programming. Hmm so how should programming be taught? Just put 100 pages of theory of this that and there and absolutely no proper instructions on actual programming, just 1-2 lab classes that's it?

Programming C? Using antiquated compilers like Turbo C++? void main()? gets()? conio.h? Some random questions on prinf("%d%d%d", a++, a--, ++a);? Mixing half the concepts of C and C++? While shift the entire focus was on some bleh generation computing or some blah someone said this and that. Books like Lets us C by Kanetkar sum up C programming education in India.Excellent education, eh?

yes, its even in my college NIT also. I am in First Year and was shocked to see teachers saying students that Yashwant Kanetkar's Let Us C is good and in labs we have to use that Turbo C. Ghoshh!!!
Also they didn't tell us how to solve different types of problems how to think. It doesn't matters to me because I have already done Python and C was no difficult for me, but my classmates get stuck at each and every problem.
They didn't know about what industry demands and about present standards!!

The System has to be totally changed.Not just engineering or any coll degree,the system has be reviewed right from 1st grade.children should be made to enjoy what they are learning.Creativity & hunger for knowledge has to be given a upper hand and not merely the marks scored.
For all this to happen the outlook of the society should gradually improve.Its sad that even now people have this notion "Marks-directly proportional-Intelligence"
Seriously most of the exams we write are nothing but just a memory test

Only those boards exams, I think are memory test, entrance exams like JEE and AIEEE, really tests students ability to think and his intelligence!!

 

[Neuron]

Only those boards exams, I think are memory test, entrance exams like JEE and AIEEE, really tests students ability to think and his intelligence!!

I don't know how true that is because my friends who attended a 1-year long entrance coaching class told me that after practicing a lot of questions they learn the method to solve a particular type of question by heart.So when they are faced with a similar type of question its the memory part that does the work,not the intelligence part.I'm sure that anyone who participates such a course and practices properly for a reasonable amount of time can surely crack IIT-JEE or AIEEE with ease.

 

[Techn0crat]

It's only us who are complaining. Just let one teacher announce to submit own project or papers. Entire class is cursing that guy and trying to manage the project or assignment. Even most faculties know that the submitted journals are copied but they don't care. It's not just engg. It's everywhere!!! I am doing BMS and hardly study. Students around me just by heart without understanding basic concept. Give them a case study and then read it later for comic relief. This system is easy for most. Easy to 'study',Easy to 'teach.'

 

[geek2091]

Only those boards exams, I think are memory test, entrance exams like JEE and AIEEE, really tests students ability to think and his intelligence!!

Agreed Hence I said "most".Atleast those crap tests & exams in school do just that!!

 

[abhijangda]

I don't know how true that is because my friends who attended a 1-year long entrance coaching class told me that after practicing a lot of questions they learn the method to solve a particular type of question by heart.So when they are faced with a similar type of question its the memory part that does the work,not the intelligence part.I'm sure that anyone who participates such a course and practices properly for a reasonable amount of time can surely crack IIT-JEE or AIEEE with ease.

Yes your friend is very much right but if you will see JEE paper then you will note that 90% of questions (or even more than that) are unseen by the students. These questions are original and are created by organising IIT's faculty. I have seen many students working hard and hard day and night, studying for more than 10 hrs but they didn't manages to get good rank or even they didn't get qualified. Even toppers, if you will ask them they will say that they just used to study for some 4-5 hrs and see the results.